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Request for Review Article

Hello is there any admin who can review this article Muhammad Ali Swati ? He is an famous award winning Pakistani rescuer. the articles included the strong rereferences from BBC, Telegraph, Independent, Arab News. Janabanigu (talk) 09:10, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

@Janabanigu, the article isn't under review. It's up for a deletion discussion. Unfortunately I don't think you'll be able to save it - we don't tend to keep articles on people who are notable for only one event. See WP:BLP1E. -- asilvering (talk) 09:13, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

@Asilvering thanks but he is a notable not only from one event but also more different things which are already mentioned in the article history, Janabanigu (talk) 09:20, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

It has been marked as reviewed, but it is now nominated for deletion. 331dot (talk) 09:13, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

@331dot yes i see . but, we can expand to add more references regarding the entity. The entity meets the GNG. Janabanigu (talk) 09:21, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Who is "we"? 331dot (talk) 09:26, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

talk about the wiki editors Janabanigu (talk) 09:27, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

References have been added after the start of the AfD, but the article is still about a person who was featured in the news for one event - rescuing people in a stuck cable car. His role in the rescue could be better described at an existing article about the event 2023 Battagram cable car incident. David notMD (talk) 10:01, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

He is already mentioned in that article's last paragraph; this could be expanded, Janabanigu, provided that it does not become disproportionate in relation to the mentions of others involved in the rescue, which could also be enlarged on. We must not unduly promote one rescuer (with a related commercial interest) over and above the others. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.1.209.45 (talk) 15:04, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello! If you’re looking to have an article about Muhammad Ali Swati, a renowned Pakistani rescuer, reviewed, it's best to reach out to an admin or editor directly on the platform where the article is published. Including strong references from reputable sources like BBC, Telegraph, Independent, and Arab News adds credibility to your article, which should help in the review process. Make sure to highlight these sources when requesting the review. Rizwan867 (talk) 11:01, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

No, that's not best. Please don't reach out to editors directly about AfC drafts unless they've made it clear they're happy to receive such requests. -- asilvering (talk) 11:04, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

To ensure your article about Muhammad Ali Swati gets reviewed, I recommend reaching out directly to the platform's admin or editor, emphasizing the credible sources like BBC, Telegraph, and others. Highlighting these references should aid the review process. At sell my house fast leavenworth, we know the value of strong, credible backing—whether in real estate or writing. Rizwan867 (talk) 17:53, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Rizwan867: Please do not advertise or use what looks like LLM-assisted language on here. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 18:11, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Evaluation for the Account

Hi, Can someone please evaluate this wiki article Muhammad Ali Swati , might be this meets GNG. The person is a award winning social worker. He rescued more than 600 people during Naran Flood in August 2024 and also crucial role in the dramatic rescue operation of a group of children trapped in a cable car in the Battagram district of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Pakistan, in August 2023. IN 2023 Prime Minister give him a award and also in 2024 he receives the High Achiever of Pakistan Award from the Current PM Shehbaz Sharif. he already setup South Asia Longest and World Highest Zipline in Naran. Janabanigu (talk) 18:42, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Your question has been answered above. Shantavira|^{feed me} 19:03, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

@Shantavira the question is different, Janabanigu (talk) 19:09, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

@Janabanigu This will be determined at the current AfD discussion. You should contribute at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Muhammad Ali Swati if you wish to influence this, making the points you have made here. Mike Turnbull (talk) 20:01, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

OP blocked: Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Thekhyberboypk --Drm310 🍁 (talk) 14:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Question About IRC

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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I am currently a user who is blocked indefinitely on the Japanese Wikipedia. And now, editing the conversation page is also prohibited. Currently, I'm trying to ask someone to unblock the talk page with the free browser version of IRC, but it doesn't work. Every time I log in to IRC, the comments I wrote before that disappear. I looked at the guide on how to use it, but it hasn't been solved. In addition, it is currently not possible to see the past log. I can only rely on this English page anymore, so I decided to ask a question here. I understand very well that I am a sinful person, and I will try not to make comments excessively even after the conversation page is released. If you are familiar with it, please give me some advice. Thank you. チューボー (talk) 14:31, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

We are unlikely to be able to help you troubleshoot your IRC client. Fortunately, the guide to appealing blocks says that you can also use the Japanese mailing list. ⇌ Jake Wartenberg 14:57, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

The mailing list is too depopulated, and the hope of cancellation is low... チューボー (talk) 14:59, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I would be very happy to ask users who have used IRC. Also, maybe it's affecting the fact that I'm using the free browser version now? チューボー (talk) 15:11, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

There are users who normally use IRC to achieve cancellation in the same way, so I understand that something is wrong. Anyway, it's a situation where I can't find any hope for the mailing list anymore. チューボー (talk) 15:03, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Upon reviewing the archives, I can see that the mailing list is indeed dormant. My only other suggestion would be to try using a different client and internet connection. ⇌ Jake Wartenberg 15:28, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I'll talk about the IRC malfunction, so I'd be happy if you could give me some advice.

I'm sorry for being so persistent, but in order to do something about my place, I have no choice but to get some advice here. Originally, it was because I repeated inappropriate behavior in the Japanese version, and I think it's a really brazen behavior. To be specific about what kind of trouble is occurring, first of all, I succeeded in logging in to IRC, but I don't know how to look at the past log, and every time I log in again after browser back, the message I posted in the past suddenly disappeared, and only "〇〇 participated in this" is displayed on the top screen. There is no one using the Japanese mailing list anymore, so I have no other means but IRC. I will reflect on my past behavior and definitely change the problems of the reason for the block, such as the lack of courtesy in the future. I feel that the fact that I'm asking a series of questions here is exhausting the community, but it's a really desperate situation... Could you please tell me the solution to the problem of IRC? チューボー (talk) 15:39, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Chupo. I know nothing about IRC. Perhaps there is something on WP:IRC that will help? ColinFine (talk) 19:51, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I'll take a look at it.Thank you very much. チューボー (talk) 21:26, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I want to know the probability that a user who has been indefinitely blocked due to a scandal will be reinstated.

 Courtesy link: WP:Teahouse § Question About IRC

I haven't used the English version much, so I don't know, but I'd like to know how many users have been indefinitely blocked on English Wikipedia in the past, and then successfully persuaded other users to return after requesting the ban be lifted. Sorry for the silly question, but I've been indefinitely blocked on the Japanese Wikipedia under the name "Second Generation Chance Two," and as you can see, I'm in an extremely hopeless situation, as I can't even use the talk page. That's why I decided to ask this question. I'd like to hear from people who have dealt with many users who have been indefinitely blocked. チューボー (talk) 23:05, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm not sure anyone will be able to give you an actual figure. In any case, it would probably underestimate the possibility of having an indefinite block lifted, since most people who are indeffed aren't trying to get their blocks removed. If you leave for a while, then come back later and apologize, you're quite likely to get a second chance. However, you really should not be using multiple accounts at the same time, especially when blocked. See WP:SOCK. -- asilvering (talk) 23:11, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm sorry. My current account was the first one I made for the English version, long before "Chance Two II."

So, just because I'm using different accounts for the Japanese and English versions, will I be subject to being arrested for using multiple accounts?

Can I avoid this by adding the words "This is the same as Chance Two II. I will no longer be using this account" to my "Chubo" account and then logging in on the English version under a new name "Chance Two II"? > チューボー (talk) 23:26, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

A block on the Japanese Wikipedia isn't a block on the English Wikipedia. If your Japanese Wikipedia username is a global account, you are not globally blocked and you can still edit other Wikipedias. See if your blocked username on the Japanese Wikipedia works here. It is never a good idea to create new accounts after being blocked. However, it isn't uncommon to use different accounts on different Wikipedias, as long as you don't have more than one account on the English Wikipedia. ~Anachronist (talk) 23:39, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

I wouldn't create a new account, personally, but you can if you want to. If you do that, you'll want to abandon all of your old accounts. The important thing is that you're editing under only one account, not which account you use to do that. Making a note about your abandoned accounts on your user page to be up-front is a good idea. Don't use any account to evade a block or ban - so, for example, don't log on to Japanese wikipedia and start editing with this account, or you'll probably be blocked on ja-wiki on this account too. Don't repeat whatever behaviour caused you to get blocked on ja-wiki on any other language wikipedia, and no one else will have any reason to block you here or anywhere else. -- asilvering (talk) 23:39, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you both. I'm going to throw away this account and log in to the English version as "Second Generation Chance Two." チューボー (talk) 23:44, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

(edit conflict) User:チューボー, the usernames you quoted do not exist. When asking questions here, please use a wikilink to link them, or if you don't know how to do that, please spell the pagename exactly as it appears, whether here, or on Japanese Wikipedia. For example, there is no such user on Japanese Wikipedia as ja:Second Generation Chance Two (talk · contribs), and there is no Chubo (talk · contribs) account here at English Wikipedia. So, please be specific about what you are referring to. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 23:48, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

Chubo is the account they're using right now, チューボー. I haven't gone looking for the others. -- asilvering (talk) 00:02, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, but there was a problem because I used Google Translate. "二代目チャンストゥー" exists in the Japanese version. チューボー (talk) 00:02, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Thanks for that; yes, user ja:二代目チャンストゥー (talk · contribs) exists there, and from your Japanese user Talk page^{[in English]} I can see that you are blocked there, and lack talk page access. However, you are still allowed to appeal your block there, and the instructions are given how to do that. Mathglot (talk) 00:15, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. I have two options, "IRC" and "mailing list", but the latter hasn't been used at all for the last few years, so by process of elimination I have no choice but to use IRC.

But there aren't that many people on IRC either, and I'm not sure if anyone will bother me since I've caused a lot of problems in the past... チューボー (talk) 00:43, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

@チューボー, Well, whether if the IRC is that active or not, the Japanese Wikipedia and the English version of Wikipedia are different so you will have appeal your block with either of those choices given, as the English Wikipedia can't do anything about it.

In courtesy in Japanese: ここでは何もできませんので、日本版の方で控訴しないといけないです。 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 01:03, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Since even conversation pages are prohibited in the Japanese version, I had no choice but to seek advice through the foreign language version. チューボー (talk) 01:13, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Also, "Chubo" is translated into Japanese as "チューボー". チューボー (talk) 00:13, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you very much to everyone for your valuable opinions. チューボー (talk) 01:12, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

I was unreasonably blocked on IRC, and I felt like I was being tricked.

I am a Japanese person who was blocked indefinitely on the Japanese Wikipedia, and I previously asked a question about IRC.

Since then, I have been successful in IRC and was able to talk to a user who I believe has the authority to block others, but as a result, that user has also blocked me from IRC #Wikipedia-ja.

At first, I briefly explained why I was blocked and what I would do after unblocking the conversation page, and added, "Please do."

In response, the user did not give any specific reason why he could not allow me, and simply refused, saying that there was nothing I could do on this IRC at the moment, given my history.

After that, when I made excuses again, the user further told me to "come back in a few years" and "leave."

So I asked, "What specifically is the reason why you cannot release me?" The user must have gotten fed up with me, because he blocked me without any warning. The individual user messaging function was not blocked, so I asked the user "Why did you block me?" and "Did I do something that deserves blocking?", but the user ignored me. I thought that was strange, but then I found out that the user had disappeared from Libera.chat.

So does this mean I was tricked? I'm sorry for being a bit persistent, but even if I was tricked, I'm very curious as to why such a user had the authority to block. Or is it just a stupid assumption that I was tricked? I'd really appreciate your thoughts on this, whether you're familiar with IRC or not. チューボー (talk) 11:11, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

@チューボー This is the English Wikipedia. We cannot help you with any issues regarding the Japanese Wikipedia. Shantavira|^{feed me} 12:37, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

As I said before, I am currently blocked from Japanese Wikipedia and cannot even edit talk pages. This is an extremely urgent situation, so please understand that...??? チューボー (talk) 12:59, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

We understand it. But there's nothing we here at English Wikipedia can do about it. If I could read Japanese (I can't) and really wanted to help, I might go to Japanese Wikipedia and try to find out why you were blocked there. But I still wouldn't have access to what happened on IRC. Maproom (talk) 13:27, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

If even IRC has been blocked, there's no way to legally return... Should I just give up? チューボー (talk) 23:06, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

If you were an editor of the English Wikipedia and had gotten a response like that here, I would advise you to "give up" temporarily. We sometimes advise editors to wait six months between unblock requests. That said, I am not familiar at all with the policies of the Japanese Wikipedia. As others already told you, there is nothing we can do here to assist you. ⇌ Jake Wartenberg 13:36, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Maproom, no need to read Japanese; see the superscript translate link in my 00:15, 23 August post above. Mathglot (talk) 02:25, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

It seems the only way to get back on Wikipedia is to violate the rules.

I am completely stuck. My talk page, email, IRC, everything is blocked. If this continues, I will probably never be able to return to the Japanese Wikipedia in the next 60 or 70 years of my life.

I'm sure you're not familiar with the Japanese Wikipedia, but please tell me if I should give up completely. チューボー (talk) 23:38, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Why were those things blocked? TooManyFingers (talk) 23:44, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

My talk page and email were blocked because my lack of literacy was revealed, including my inability to tolerate provocation.

As for IRC, I really don't understand what's going on, and I don't understand why I was blocked. チューボー (talk) 23:52, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, チューボー. We cannot help you with the Japanese Wikipedia, but if you think that "violating the rules" is the way to get reinstated, then you misunderstand the situation. When I read your English Wikipedia talk page, I see repeated warnings about problematic behavior. Administrators are much more willing to unblock an editor who is editing productively on another language version than to unblock an editor who is causing problems on another language version. So, your first step is to stop breaking rules and stop creating problems. Read WP:Standard offer and conduct yourself accordingly. Read WP:Unblock Ticket Request System. Japanese Wikipedia probably has a similar process. Cullen328 (talk) 23:53, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm saying that I can't carry out that process because the talk page is blocked. チューボー (talk) 23:58, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

@チューボー, the process on ja-wiki can be done by email. But I would really advise you not to try. Leave the place behind for a while. No one is going to think you've reformed if the disruption you caused is so recent. -- asilvering (talk) 00:13, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I am also prohibited from sending wikimail, and one of the reasons for my block level increase was for sending wikimail to an unspecified number of people. チューボー (talk) 00:54, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I reiterate that the best action for you to take here is inaction. -- asilvering (talk) 00:56, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

So contribute to articles (and not merely talk pages such as this) within English-language Wikipedia. -- Hoary (talk) 23:56, 26 August 2024 (UTC) Now that, prompted by Nick Moyes, I look at your past contributions, I realize that we don't want any more of them, or anyway none that are similar to those you have already made. -- Hoary (talk) 00:10, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@チューボー You appear to be editing under a different account name than that which you claim is blocked on ja-wikipedia. So it's impossible to suggest what you need to do. Looking at your past contributions under this account name, you do appear to think it's OK to add your own personal view of a topic. (Example) This is a huge "No-No" here. DO NOT DO IT!!!

You've ben warned about this many times. You must never, ever insert your own views on a topic. Everything needs to be sourced to a Reliable Source. I have no experience of IRC, so can't advise on that area. If you are not willing to add content based only upon good quality sources, then, yes, it is time to give up editing Wikipedia. Nick Moyes (talk) 00:00, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

They're ja:User:二代目チャンストゥー. Previously at the teahouse here: [1]. -- asilvering (talk) 00:14, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I have no intention of making foolish edits like that again, and I am currently in the process of seriously reading the Japanese version of the guidelines.

It seems that the problem I'm facing now is not so much the poor quality of my edits, but rather a lack of courtesy towards other users. チューボー (talk) 00:39, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Digital tattoo

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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I'm the same person who asked the question before. As I said before, I have been indefinitely blocked on the Japanese version for various reasons, including a lack of etiquette and making my password public. These will become digital tattoos, but I am worried about how much of an impact this "indefinite block" will have on things like job hunting. I think a large part of my failure was probably due to my own immaturity, so I would be happy if the impact is minimal... チューボー (talk) 23:06, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

We cannot help you with the Japanese Wikipedia or topics not related to Wikipedia. Please stop posting about your block. RudolfRed (talk) 00:03, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

This is the English Wikipedia, so we cannot handle requests on the Japanese Wikipedia. Most employers probably don't care about who gets blocked from Wikipedia that much so you're probably good. CharlieEdited (talk) 00:04, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

In coutresy. There is an oversight on the Japanese Wikipedia. See: Wikipedia:オーバーサイトの方針.

Once again, this is the English Wikipedia so we cannot do anything about your block on the Japanese Wikipedia. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 00:12, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Australian or Papuan language Wikimedias

Are there any Wikimedia projects written in indigenous languages of Australia or Papua? (I know about the Tok Pisin Wikipedia but that doesn't count.) If not, are there are any that are in the incubator, proposed, or have been shut down? 73.170.137.168 (talk) 17:23, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi IP, I'm not sure about the answer to this question myself, but you'll be able to figure it out by looking at List of Wikipedias. -- asilvering (talk) 19:10, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

That page does not appear to include incubator projects. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:26, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

See meta:Noongarpedia. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:25, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for showing me this link. Though the website seems to be mostly in English. Even though it talks about Noongar culture, I don't really understand the purpose of this. I will try to research the language more. 73.170.137.168 (talk) 17:48, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

The page I linked to is in English, but links to several pages and projects written in the Noongar language. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:29, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, I meant that the Noongar Wikipedia in the incubator is mostly in English. 73.170.137.168 (talk) 19:36, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

It might be that they've ported over the important pages from English wikipedia and just haven't finished translating them into Noongar yet? I'm not sure what the typical workflow is for languages in the incubator stage. -- asilvering (talk) 22:17, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I guess each of these languages is too small for an effective Wikipedia. They're probably all smaller than the Cree Wikipedia, which is already in danger of being shut down. But somehow the Atikamekw Wikipedia seems fairly successful even though the language is tiny? 73.170.137.168 (talk) 17:50, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

I suspect that for a language's Wikipedia to be a success, the level of dedication of each individual editor and reader can make a real difference. If my language has a billion speakers but absolutely none of them are interested in Wikipedia, you can see what would happen. TooManyFingers (talk) 23:00, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Add a certificate to a Wiki page

I wish to add a certificate (from a Public Prosecutor's Office) on a website that exonerates the gentleman concerned of any crimes. I don't know how to add the PDF certificate to the site. One has to jump through so many loops. Thank you Xander Fir (talk) 07:38, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Xander Fir.

First question: has this certificate been published? If not, then it may not be cited and no information from it may be used in the article (unless the information is also in a published source, of course, in which case why is the certificate relevant?)

Second point: if it is published, then it may be cited, but it will be a primary source, from which only uncontroversial factual information may be cited. So the article could then say something like "The Public Prosecutor's Office stated that ... ", but must not attempt to draw any conclusions from that statement - that would be original research, which is forbidden in a Wikipedia Article.

I suggest you have a look at WP:RIGHTINGGREATWRONGS - Wikipedia is not the place for advocacy, no matter how worthy the cause may be. ColinFine (talk) 09:16, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi Colin Fine, thanks for your reply. If one checks at the Public Prosecutors Office in Palermo, as per the doc I want to upload, which was published (issued) by them, you will find that there is nothing outstanding against Palazzolo. Wikipedia is happy to publish news from the media, which is so famously mistrusted by people, but they don't want to publish a primary source document fromn the court that charged him in the first place. Palazzolo is 77 now and exhausted by this battle to prove his innocence, fighting the likes of Wikipedia, from the start, and - given his exoneration and freedom thereof - wants to drop it. No one can arrest him or impune him any more. 197.87.7.130 (talk) 08:13, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I mean impugn 197.87.7.130 (talk) 08:19, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Vito Roberto Palazzolo website

I edited Palazzolo's wiki page, and my edit was removed. Added to which I want to upload the document from the Public Prosecutors Office at the Court of Palermo (Sicily) that exonerated him of all crimes. Can anyone help me do this, and why was my edit removed? Xander Fir (talk) 07:43, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

The article's history shows that Frost has asked you to argue persuasively in Talk:Vito Roberto Palazzolo for your proposed changes. Please do so. This "document": Where is it published? -- Hoary (talk) 07:51, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I looked at the Talk site, listing our old arguments. I couldn't find anything referring to my latest edit, where I want to add the fact of Palazzolo's exoneration - of all criminal charges - by the Public Prosecutors office in Palermo. What I want to add is something new, and uncontestable. I don't need to argue "persuasively", but present the document. It's over now. Xander Fir (talk) 08:24, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Where have you found this document? And wherever it is, hasn't it been adequately summarized by reliable Italian news websites? -- Hoary (talk) 08:49, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I looked at what you added. Here's its second half: {{Expert needed}} I need an expert to help me upload the document from the Public Prosecutor's Office in Palermo, that exonerates Palazzolo of all criminal charges. Almost certainly no such upload would be appropriate, let alone necessary. If it were appropriate, then an article would be about the least appropriate place to ask for help in the enterprise. So Frost was entirely right to make the deletion. -- Hoary (talk) 08:01, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Why would an authentic document exonerating a man of his crimes (after 40 years) not be "appropriate", or "necessary"? And why if it was appropriate, as you suggest, would "an article...... be about the least appropriate place to ask for help in the enterprise." I don't understand what you mean. Xander Fir (talk) 08:29, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I didn't say the document would be inappropriate (though I suspect that it would be). I said that uploading it would be inappropriate. Xander Fir, if you can point me to one or two other articles here within which "I" describes his or her needs and appeals for help, please do so. But until you do, I'll maintain that an article is a highly inappropriate place for such an appeal. Post it on the article's talk page. -- Hoary (talk) 08:49, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for replying. Apologies, but I still don't understand what you mean. A document (not an article) was recently released (30/11/23) exonerating a man of his crimes. After 40 years that's BIG news. How can I add a very brief explanation of that on his Wikipedia page, and for autheticity's sake, upload the document? And then we can lay it to rest. Xander Fir (talk) 09:23, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

If it is "BIG news", then you should have no trouble providing news sources which have reported on it. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:47, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Are there no independent reliable sources that report on this man being exonerated of a crime? It shouldn't be necessary to use a primary source. 331dot (talk) 09:18, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

The Head of Certification Service at the Public Prosecutor's Office in Palermo is a "reliable source". Could there be anything more authentic, original and reliable than this? Xander Fir (talk) 09:32, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

It may be reliable, but it is not independent. Are there no news reports of this man being exonerated of a crime? 331dot (talk) 09:33, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

'll get back to you ASAP with that. Thank you Xander Fir (talk) 10:07, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

How is the Public Prosecutor's Office not independent of Vito Roberto Palazzolo? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:47, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Indepedent or not, it's a primary source, not an indepedent commentary. ColinFine (talk) 15:48, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I wasn't questioning it being a primary source; but the claim that it is not independent. The page to which you link is quote clear: "Primary sources that have been reputably published may be used in Wikipedia [...] with care. A primary source may be used on Wikipedia [...] to make straightforward, descriptive statements of facts that can be verified by any educated person with access to the primary source but without further, specialized knowledge". Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:37, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

A media article is independent, but historically often skewed. Since a primary source from the Court itself isn't acceptable, what is? An opinion from another person? 197.87.7.130 (talk) 07:34, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

No source is without bias. The sources are presented to readers so they can evaluate and judge factors like bias for themselves in determining what to believe for themselves. A source being biased does not preclude its use on Wikipedia unless it is alleged the source is so biased that it makes stuff up out of whole cloth. No matter how biased a source is- being exonerated is a straightforward claim that bias would not affect in and of itself.

A court is not an independent source for its own rulings. 331dot (talk) 08:37, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

That does not mean that a court document could not be used as a source in the article under discussion. The court is independent of the article subject. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello Pigsonthewing

Thank you. I can't undertand why a man exonerated of his crimes can't - apparently - upload a document that clears him. In very simple language, can I upload the court document mentioned, or not? I can send it to you to review first? 197.155.23.71 (talk) 15:44, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

So you represent this man?

I don't understand why you can't provide a news report stating that this man was exonerated of a crime. 331dot (talk) 15:48, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

He's a friend who's 77 and struggles with IT and tired of it all.

I said I would help, if I could.

He would like to clear it with Wikipedia, but doesn't have to as the litigation is now over.

He hits the roof - obviously - when I send him requests from Wikipedia, which has published so much for so long from media sources with an agenda (like newspaper sales), but now suddenly questions the evidence of documented clearance from the Public Prosecutors Office itself.

So - lets leave it; he no longer cares what you publish, and neither do I. 197.155.23.71 (talk) 16:17, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Are you saying the news is willfully refusing to report this? 331dot (talk) 16:22, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

After 40 years of media disingenuity he is 'willfully refusing' to speak to them anymore. 197.87.7.130 (talk) 10:31, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

You can't upload a document which is subject to copyright, without a 'Wikimedia compatible licence allowing it's reuse. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:59, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm trying to help you, I really am. We just need an appropriate independent source. Has he given an interview to a newspaper, which would then fact check his exoneration and report on it? 331dot (talk) 16:24, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I may sound irrascible, but appreciate your help. Palazzolo is old now and exhausted and done with trying to present his case. He certainly won't speak to the media, and can't understand why a bone fide court document is unacceptable to Wikipedia, as is. If I get the chance, I will ask him for further, independent evidence that it is real, but I won't hold my breath. Thank you 197.87.7.130 (talk) 10:26, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Changing the Source of A file

Hello, I have uploaded a file as my own work because I misunderstood the statement. I do not know how can I change this. I would appreciate some help with it. Istarek (talk) 11:59, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

You'll need to edit the description page on Wikimedia Commons to change the source and author to their correct values. You'll also probably need to change the licensing info, and note that the image can only stay on Commons if it has been released under a suitable free license. J11csd (talk) 12:55, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

It looks like you've updated the source (although bear in mind that it's often useful to mention where the file came from, not just who), but left the author as yourself. This parameter should reflect the original creator of the file (i.e. the person who took the photo), not the uploader. J11csd (talk) 09:55, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Websites for road lengths

Hello. I was wondering if somebody could help me find a website for road lengths. On the A508 road, I used the "measure distance" tool, however last week, it was taken to AfD (see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/A508 road), as it appeared to be original research in some editors' eyes. However, the only reason I used it was because the only other place I could find this kind of information was on SABRE Roads - an unreliable website made by road enthusiasts. Therefore, I was wondering if you lot could help. Is Google Maps OK for something like this if it is the last resort? Or is it OK all the time? Can you find any other free websites that presents this kind of information? Many thanks in advance! Regards, Roads4117 (talk) 19:56, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I suspect perhaps the real message is "stop wanting to put precise lengths". Finding a source is not the point. The point is finding a trustworthy, easily-verifiable, stable source. Google gives slightly different answers each time and is not necessarily stable.

Is there a publicly accessible government document on this? TooManyFingers (talk) 22:30, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

There is probably no such source, because such information is unimportant. Shantavira|^{feed me} 07:50, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@Shantavira, actually, such information is important, as it shows how important the road is: there is a big difference between the A1 at approximately 410 miles (660 km) and the A38 at 292 miles (470 km), compared with the A79 at 7.7 miles (12.4 km), or the A3215 at 0.2 miles (0.32 km). Furthermore, the road length needs to be found somewhere in the article (especially in the infobox), so actually it is really important to have in road articles! Roads4117 (talk) 08:05, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

It doesn't "need to be found". If the single road length cannot be found from a reliable source then it should be deleted/not-given. Yes that probably affects the quality of the article but no information is always better than unsourced information or original research. Verifiability trumps the truth every time. Also, there is a big difference between an overall road length, which is a single number, and what we get in some articles which is excessive detail of the distances between multiple waypoints. The former is of encyclopaedic interest if it can be properly sourced (the subject of this discussion) but the latter is really not relevant. 10mmsocket (talk) 07:42, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

So are you basically saying that every road length on every article infobox and/or junction table that is not sourced has to then be removed due to WP:V? If that is what you are saying, then although I do agree that policies and all that come first, I also think that then the quality of the articles deteriorates. Roads4117 (talk) 08:26, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Why do you think that removing unverified information causes article quality to deteriorate? Removing such information is a GoodThing™ 10mmsocket (talk) 08:36, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes it is a good thing, but it just removes important information from the article. Roads4117 (talk) 19:42, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Importance is subjective and cannot trump Wikipedia's standards. 10mmsocket (talk) 21:28, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

No, not that I can find (apart from on roads like the A1), which is the problem; other than oh major roads, your options are (1) add a unreliable source like SABRE roads, made from road enthusiasts, which is more than likely to be reverted, or (2) add Google Maps 'measure distance' tool, which gets challenged as original research or copyvio when the article goes to AfD. So either way, you cannot win (unless someone else finds another source). Roads4117 (talk) 07:57, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

The answer is really simple. If you cannot source it, don't add it. 10mmsocket (talk) 07:43, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@10mmsocket, and I just remembered, the third option is to program the route of the road into Google Maps, from A to B, via C, D, E, etc., like the example at R102 road (Ireland). Does that count as original research/being unreliable etc.? However, my only problems with this way are: (1) you have to eyeball the route from start to finish, which on a 6-mile-long suburban road in outer London is not that bad, but on the A1, that might be a slight problem, as it is 410 miles (660 km) long, but also as you can only add seven stop off points in total, and (2) if the road is shut for whatever reason, then it may say that the road length is substantially longer than it actually is. What are your thoughts on this?... Roads4117 (talk) 08:21, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes it is original research. 10mmsocket (talk) 08:34, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@10mmsocket, but just out of interest, how is that classified as original research? Roads4117 (talk) 19:39, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

See WP:SYNTH. You may consider WP:CALC means that you can add up distances, but if those distances are not clearly stated on the source then interpretation of individual section lengths calculation of the total road length is not a simple operation - it is synthesis. 10mmsocket (talk) 21:25, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

And also, could we just do the 'measure distance' tool thing, but only to one or two decimal place(s)? Roads4117 (talk) 19:47, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

It is original research. 10mmsocket (talk) 21:20, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@10mmsocket OK, then. In that case, how are we then supposed to prove the road lengths? Roads4117 (talk) 07:28, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Find a source. For motorways and A roads in the strategic roads network, it is feasible that National Highways might have documents - as they're the road owner. 10mmsocket (talk) 08:02, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@10mmsocket Good point! I will have a look now! Roads4117 (talk) 08:09, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Road lengths in Great Britain statistics: Methodology and quality note outlines the collection of such data, including the Major Roads Database (MRDB) and the Ordnance Survey (OS) MasterMap Highways Network dataset. As ever, the datasets may not be directly available to the general public or without payment. NebY (talk) 09:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I looked on the Department of Transport website on GOV.UK, and I have found the following citations (it is not what we are looking for, but it is still useful). I will check the National Highways website now. Roads4117 (talk) 09:41, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

And what is the in-house view on this? @Maproom, @Nick Moyes, @Cullen328 etc.? Roads4117 (talk) 07:44, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Roads4117, I rarely if ever work on articles about roads. In day to day life off-Wikipedia, I often need to calculate driving distances for my small family business. I use Google Maps and find it quite accurate. But you have to gain consensus for whatever you end up using. Cullen328 (talk) 07:57, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Cullen328, thanks for that advice! Roads4117 (talk) 08:08, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I suggest that common sense, possibly WP:IAR, says that a road article needs a figure for its length, to distinguish a 10-mile road from a 200-mile one. Google maps seems reliable enough to offer that single figure, perhaps with "about" to give a little bit of wriggle-room. I note that Good Article A82 road cites Google Maps for its length. PamD 08:50, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@NebY, @PamD, @10mmsocket, BTW there was a similar disccussion in September/October 2022 about whether Google Maps is a reliable source or not at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard/Archive 388#Google Maps. Also see WP:GOOGLEMAPS, which, in a nutshell, states the following: Google Maps and Google Street View may be useful for some purposes, including finding and verifying geographic coordinates and other basic information like street names. However, especially for objects like boundaries (of neighborhoods, allotments, etc.), where other reliable sources are available they should be preferred over Google Maps and Google Street View. It can also be difficult or impossible to determine the veracity of past citations, since Google Maps data is not publicly archived, and may be removed or replaced as soon as it is not current. Inferring information solely from Street View pictures may be considered original research. Roads4117 (talk) 10:11, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/News and notes#A fork in the Roads WikiProject for one consequence of such discussions. (I provide this for your information, Roads4117, not to open a fresh discussion on the difficulties some editors have found with WP:RS w/regards to roads and maps; that has already been covered at length in high-profile discussions, statements and actions, and the Teahouse would not be the place anyway.) NebY (talk) 10:37, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

How long is a piece of road network? CMD (talk) 11:00, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Longer than a piece of string (mostly) 10mmsocket (talk) 12:31, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

References

JOËL (singer) Article

Hello! I had a question regarding an article i recently finished writing. I just submitted one of my first ever full articles as a draft, but it got declined. I was wondering if any of you could tell me how i should modify my article so it does get accepted? I understand that claims made on Discord typically don't get accepted, but Joël has shared many of the details i mentioned in the article elsewhere as well, and they align consistently and perfectly with his public persona (and the details he shared). He has openly talked about his experiences, like growing up in the forests like Aurora Aksnes, his admiration for certain artists, his childhood, and his goals in various digital interviews and social media platforms. He seems to be very transparent about his past and present, making it highly unlikely that he's not being truthful. In my perspective. I would appreciate any advice on how to properly cite these sources and structure the article to meet Wikipedia's standards!

Draft:Joël Galliard

(Plus, release information about his debutsong, i couldn't find anywhere else but social media like SoundCloud and Spotify.) (All of the other information was taken from his own shared photos, posts, and messages on various platforms, the most recurring one being Discord, specifically a Discord Server named 'Mothership' [a popular fan server for artist AURORA]). Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 00:34, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@Plopperdeplop12345, you've provided information that is verifiable, which is good. But what you're missing is any evidence of his notability. We want references from secondary sources for this, not just statements the subject has made. See WP:BIO. -- asilvering (talk) 00:50, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

What's missing is for you to quote big media outlets who write featured articles about him, where they say he is already famous and already popular. TooManyFingers (talk) 00:51, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

TooManyFingers, reliable, disinterested sources do not have to be "big media outlets". Neither fame nor popularity is necessary. -- Hoary (talk) 00:54, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Strictly you are absolutely right. Yet the misunderstanding persists and persists that simply providing true information is somehow the key, and while my words are not strictly correct, they do give at least a reasonably correct (and corrective) impression – something that years and years of strictly correct explanations have consistently failed to convey. TooManyFingers (talk) 01:04, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

That's the issue, he's a very new artist; he hasn't had any reviews, interviews, or any other articles yet. All of the references come from his own pages, and his chats in a Discord server named Mothership (which i mentioned earlier). There aren't any other sources or articles about him yet, and Wikipedia is the only website i know of where i could permanently put in claims with prove to back those claims up (again, his own messages and pages). Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 01:22, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Sorry @Plopperdeplop12345, in that case, he doesn't meet our notability guidelines, so we won't publish an article on him. -- asilvering (talk) 01:27, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I understand. Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 01:47, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@Plopperdeplop12345, it sounds like you have a case of WP:TOOSOON - it's entirely possible he'll become notable, and if you make a small edit to your draft every six months it will be ready to go if/when he does meet the guidelines. Even adding/removing a space or full stop counts as a small edit, but of course you could take the opportunity to search for any new information on him and reassess whether it's time to submit. You'll get a warning at the five-month mark for your draft, so take that as the time to make an edit and keep the draft active. Fingers crossed he gets noticed and notable soon! StartGrammarTime (talk) 02:45, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Hey, thank you! I never knew the five-month mark by the way haha. Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 03:13, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

From a note on the draft, this appears to be an attempt at an article about yourself. See WP:AUTO for why the rarely works. David notMD (talk) 02:48, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Huh? No, this is not an article about myself. Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 03:13, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

What note on the draft? Again, i am not writing an article about myself. Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 03:14, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Quoted from an edit summary in October of last year by user JoelDeKabouter on an article which was then called Kabouter Plop but which is now called Studio 100:

I dedicated a significant amount of time to thoroughly revise the wiki page, incorporating reliable references and embedding relevant links. The majority of the content present in this English rendition of the article has been meticulously crafted and translated by me, Joël Galliard. This undertaking was a labor-intensive effort. There is still alot of missing info, so any help would be highly appreciated.

These "Plop"s and "Joël Galliard"s and "Kabouter"s seem to be proliferating on Wikipedia somehow.

(The "dedicated, thorough, and meticulous" edit by Joël Galliard/JoelDeKabouter was reverted because it contained no reliable references.) TooManyFingers (talk) 05:03, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

The draft starts with "Notes to admins: writing references in here was a pain, as they somehow cloned themselves haha. Nothing to worry tho, i can fix it when this article gets accepted. JOËL (singer)" How is that not you? David notMD (talk) 07:26, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I think the OP meant "JOËL (singer)" to be the title of their new article and so placed it at the top, as I've seen some other new folks do; they weren't using it as a signature to their prior message. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 13:53, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

That makes sense. David notMD (talk) 16:48, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that is what i meant. Sorry for the confusion! I am indeed a new wikipedian haha Plopperdeplop12345 (talk) 20:45, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Employ AI-driven animation software to ensure smooth and professional character movements.

Employ AI-driven animation software to ensure smooth and professional character movements. 45.124.15.205 (talk) 04:41, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Feel free to do it yourself. -- Hoary (talk) 05:25, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Animation software already does this. No AI is necessary for such trivia. Shantavira|^{feed me} 12:51, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

This is not relevant to Wikipedia in any way. CharlieEdited (talk) 00:07, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

IRC

Are wikipedia policies are applicable to its IRC channels? ExclusiveEditor _{Notify Me!} 11:27, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes and no. Common sense applies. But: IRC has no article namespace, or an equivalent (so policies related to it don't apply) for example. Could you be more specific? Luhanopi (talk) 13:30, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@Luhanopi: I forgot to mention. Like WP:CIVILITY. ExclusiveEditor _{Notify Me!} 14:39, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Mostly should be followed (except for the sections related to edit summaries, obviously). In my opinion, that policy is common sense. How and whether it will be enforced is another thing, Luhanopi (talk) 15:32, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

As I said below, Wikipedia's policies do not apply in any way to IRC, except at the discretion of those running the IRC channels. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 15:54, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Ok. But that particular policy is mostly common sense. Whether or not the policy applies, the behavior against that policy would likely not end well. Luhanopi (talk) 15:56, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@ExclusiveEditor, the only policies which apply to the IRC channels are those which the folks running the channels decide to institute. They're not run by the WMF and aren't required to follow any rules set up on WMF projects. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 13:43, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

But, common sense of course applies. Luhanopi (talk) 14:24, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Common sense applies if the owners decide to apply it; in the end, it's their server. Though Libera Chat, as the provider of the software, may also have some say in the matter - not sure how much, I'm a Discord regular rather than IRC. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 14:34, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

You probably won't succeed in getting a policy applied to someone else – there's not likely going to be any external pressure applied to them unless they become a constant problem to everyone. (Or unless they do something illegal.) You would certainly be wise to act as if Wikipedia policies apply, but it would be very difficult to make anyone else do the same if they didn't want to. TooManyFingers (talk) 16:23, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Don't people get blocked over screenshots of what they write? Logoshimpo (talk) 03:38, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm IP blocked and I need to change my password

I've been trying to log in with my other devices, but I forgot my password. I can't change it because I'm IP blocked even though I have my email address linked. Is there a way to change it from a device that's already logged in? BadEditor92 (talk) 17:26, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Blocks have no impact on merely logging in. If you have forgotten your password, and the recovery email does not work, or you didn't have one, you may end up needing to create a replacement account. 331dot (talk) 17:33, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I have a recovery email, I just don't know how to use it. BadEditor92 (talk) 19:20, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

A Draft and a Mainspace article having the same title.

I've noticed that there is Draft:National Management Committee of the United Party for National Development and there is also National Management Committee of the United Party for National Development (both have the same title & the same author). Now that I have noticed this, should I simply redirect the Draft to the Mainspace article, considering that the only difference between them is that the Mainspace article cites a "political party constitution" and has less paragraphs & considering that the Draft was once submitted and rejected? GeographicAccountant (talk) 18:13, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I think avoid doing that; the draft probably needs to be deleted, not redirected. TooManyFingers (talk) 22:16, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Alright. Thanks. GeographicAccountant (talk) 00:42, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Photo help

Hello,

I read your article regarding how to provide a licensed photo for others to update the Wikipedia page dedicated to me. The image can be found here:

https://www.facebook.com/share/aNsmVcy2JPh8Vnfv/?mibextid=xfxF2i

My Wikipedia page currently features a photo that is nearly 5 years old. I wanted to provide a more current option. Your article said I could post this update here for others to see and potentially assist. My Wikipedia page is:

Chris Ulmer

Thank you for the information and I hope I did this correctly. Please let me know if there's anything else I need to do. Florida1103 (talk) 18:45, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I forgot to mention that the photo is a selfie I took. Florida1103 (talk) 18:47, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Chris. Welcome to the Teahouse. You have correctly supplied an image on your FB page with the right licence which we need for someone to upload that photo to Wikimedia Commons. All you need to do is not remove the licence text! To help you out, I'll copy and upload it to Commons in the next few minutes for you to save you a job. How's that? Regards from the UK, Nick Moyes (talk) 18:59, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

That sounds amazing. Thank you for your help! Once it's on Wikipedia Commons will it be utilized on my page pretty quickly or does it just depend on if someone chooses to make the change? I'm totally new to Wikipedia and appreciate your assistance. Florida1103 (talk) 19:03, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@Florida1103 I've just uploaded your photo to Commons and then inserted it into the article about you. So you're all sorted! See Chris Ulmer.

Should you ever in the future feel the need to get changes made, you can always make an 'edit request' on the article's talk page. See WP:EDITREQUEST for guidance how to do this - it draws the attention of editors who will assess your request and make the necessary change (or decline it), as appropriate. If you intend never to edit again, you need do nothing more. But, if you do plan to make edits, you obviously would have a conflict of interest. We then ask editors to make a declaration on their user page as to that conflict. See WP:COI for guidance. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 19:19, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

You are awesome! Can't thank you enough for your help and all of the information. Florida1103 (talk) 19:51, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

removing extended protection

It looks like a new editor has removed the extended protection on Tim Walz's page, diff here, saying "deleted the padlock - let the silliness begin." I don't know anything about how these protections get set or removed, but I suspect that it's not something for a new editor to be fiddling with, especially not with that kind of comment, and I wanted to check whether I should revert it. In fact, I don't understand how a new user was able to edit that page if it was protected. Thanks FactOrOpinion (talk) 20:48, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@FactOrOpinion Removing the padlock icon doesn't actually unprotect the page. Fortunately, only administrators can do that. The page is still protected. Cremastra (talk) 20:55, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Ah, I hadn't realized that it was just for the padlock icon. Thanks! FactOrOpinion (talk) 20:59, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for flagging this, @FactOrOpinion! The page was protected at the extended-confirmed level for a while, and that recently expired. Rather than dropping back down to the semi-protected level, it became unprotected. A bot would have removed the padlock icon shortly, but that user did it first. It's hard to tell whether their intentions were just to reflect the page's protection status or if they thought they were unprotecting it. I have re-applied semi-protection now, and the bots will re-apply the icon shortly. (Someday the icons may be applied automatically, which will be nice.) Sdkb ^talk 21:03, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for that additional explanation, FactOrOpinion (talk) 21:08, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

I've asked the editor (who incidentally first edited in 2019). -- Hoary (talk) 22:25, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Content dispute

Hello, this is regarding content dispute on Pawan Kalyan and the relevant discussion is here: Talk:Pawan Kalyan#August 2024. The user @L5boat has performed cleanup on the article, which is very much appreciated, as the article needed a revamp. As part of the cleanup, the user introduced a few headers and phrases constituting the nature of promotion which is being added again and again in various forms and ways even after another editor and me have reverted them. Currently the discussion is ongoing and meanwhile the user contests that he had placed the status quo until then but that's false. That isn't the status quo content but the content placed by him and now before even the discussion ended, he removed the POV tag himself, before reaching the consensus. Here: [2] I neither agree to the changes he made nor endorse his edits. The content in dispute is here: [3] (you can see the content difference here).

1. Would be appropriate if someone can independently review the content difference as to determine if it is in the nature of the promotion or not. 2. Alternatively or preferably place back the POV Tagline until the dispute is resolved. 456legendtalk 22:45, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

@456legend: Please follow the process at WP:DR. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:56, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Uploading an image of an election diagram I made for my sandbox page

Hello. I want to upload an image of a parliament diagram I made (using the Commons template for election diagrams) based on the results of a game of a mod to the Campaign Trail (mod here, mod showcase here, browser game I played here.) I want to use the sandbox page to help me practice potentially editing image pages in the future. Are images uploaded chiefly for sandbox pages allowed on the English Wikipedia? Thanks. CharlieEdited (talk) 00:02, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

If no claim is being made for "fair use", then files for eventual use within en:Wikipedia should really be uploaded directly to Commons. Now, can these images "be realistically useful for an educational purpose"? ("Educational" surely means "educational for the readers of Wikipedia, Wikiquote, Wikiversity, or whatever", not just "educational for the uploader".) I can't comment further as I don't understand your description of your proposed image. (Are you proposing to create an article about this game? I see that there exists Campaign Trail: The Game of Presidential Elections, a feeble article about a board game that I imagine is unrelated.) -- Hoary (talk) 00:19, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I am uploading the image so I can put it on my sandbox page to practice editing. I used the parliament maker to make a parliament based on one of my sessions of the web game (the web game is unrelated to the article you put, yes.) The actual content of the image itself is mostly irrelevant and the main discussion here is about uploading images exclusively for your sandbox page. I should have worded it better. CharlieEdited (talk) 00:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

on unnecessarily advanced searches

by the black goat with a thousand young, this upcoming question may be my most oddly specific one yet~

with or without whatever tools i might be able to find in the preferences, is there a practical-ish way to filter a search to find

• only redirects containing or starting with a certain word;
• good or featured articles containing or starting with a certain word;
• redirects to good or featured articles;
• any mix of the above

because going through every title containing the prefix "the" for a niche use i'll realistically only need for a non-shitposty purpose once might take a while cogsan _{(nag me) (stalk me)} 00:06, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

You can use this SQL query for bullet #1. Log in, click "Fork", change '^Test' to your desired search word (but keep the ^), then click "Submit Query" to get your results.

Bullets 2 and 3 are probably possible. You can ask at WP:QUERY for that one. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:29, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

hehehe i stoled it for my own query >:3 (evil)

it sure isn't in a rush to execute, but i guess "the" is a pretty common word

until then, thanks cogsan _{(nag me) (stalk me)} 11:25, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Well I got thoroughly nerd-sniped by this question, so here's a query I came up with. It takes a good minute or so to run, and I can't be certain it's perfectly logically correct, and it only does featured articles, but the results do at least seem reasonable. J11csd (talk) 01:16, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@J11csd. Nice job with your query. Feel free to watchlist WP:QUERY if you want more nerd snipes of this type :) –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:32, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Editing a reference

on this page I am trying to update a dead link:

es:Ronnie Earl#Ronnie Earl and the Broadcasters

at the bottom of this section there are three links. The top one is dead and I want to replace it with an archive.org link.

http://www.bostonblues.com/stories.php?key=storyEarl should be

https://web.archive.org/web/20101212075158/http://bostonblues.com/features.php?key=storyEarl

When i enter edit mode and click in that area it only shows me the bottom link of the three. Completely confused.

This whole section doesn't even exist on the english version of the page. Dune17856 (talk) 00:34, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Using MediaWiki, you don't edit a reference where the reference appears, you edit it at the point from which it springs (or from one of these). If you have further questions about editing es.Wikipedia, better ask them there, not here. -- Hoary (talk) 00:48, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

TY, but them there sent me here to seek guidance from the community. But will try to decipher your response. Dune17856 (talk) 13:34, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

actually very helpful response. Problem solved. TY! Dune17856 (talk) 13:55, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I Would Like to be "adopted" by an admin

hello I would like to be "adopted" by an admin. I have been on wikipedia for a long time 3-4 years usually I have been just using it but now i'm trying to actually USE it. So I would like an admin to teach me how to be one. And if you can teach me how to edit more skillfully then I would be very happy. (btw I know my account says like "made yesterday" but I lost my original account due to neglectfulness to passwords I swear i'm better now) Stuuf7 (talk) 00:51, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Stuuf7, take a look at Wikipedia:Adopt-a-user/Adoptee's Area. -- Hoary (talk) 01:10, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Ok thanks a lot this will help. Stuuf7 (talk) 01:13, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Stuuf7 Why an admin? There are only a limited number of these and they have a lot of work to do! We have a specific mentoring system described at WP:GTF and your new account should have received a mentor, which you will see if you go to your userpage: there should be a "Homepage" tab there which has suggestions for what to edit and the name of your assigned mentor. If your account doesn't have this, then set one up at Special:Preferences by ticking the box at "Display newcomer homepage" and saving changes. The "Adopt-a-user" scheme is an older set-up which is less used these days, I think, Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:09, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I apologise, I was just saying that I would like to be adopted obviously I don't think It would be fro a admin it was just a thing Stuuf7 (talk) 12:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Making a English Article that exists in another language

Hello~ I saw a Wikipedia page for a Korean band that exists in Korean. However when I tried to submit an English version of the article it was rejected as not being notable and not having sources. I would assume that if the band were not notable there wouldn't be a Korean page. Any advice on what to do? YooAnneMee (talk) 00:53, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Your assumption is mistaken. And your reading of the template is mistaken too: your draft was not rejected but declined, meaning that you're welcome to improve it and, when its problems seem to be fixed, to resubmit it. -- Hoary (talk) 01:12, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

[Edit Conflict] Each language's Wikipedia is an independent project, which sets its own standards. The English-language Wikipedia is generally considered to set the most stringent standards for WP:Notability and Sources, so it's quite possible that the Korean Wikipedia accepts subjects as notable, and minimum levels of required sources, that this Wikipedia would not.

In this instance, in addition to the above-linked policies, WP:Notability (music) will be of interest to you. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.1.209.45 (talk) 01:21, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

The band looks notable to me so I suggest you add a couple more sources with significant coverage and resubmit. C F A 💬 01:22, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Barnstar

Hi,

I wish to award someone a Barnstar for helping me out recently. Can I do it by myself.? or an admin decides it.? —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 00:54, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Perfectodefecto, Yes. You can award barnstars to other users. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 02:02, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

barnstars are awards given by the community to signify something great. Stuuf7 (talk) 02:21, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Unclear about academic notability criteria

Hi, I just submitted a draft article about an academic today, and it was declined by Utopes. First, thank you for the rapid response! I was expecting to wait perhaps months.

Utopes described the reason for declination as being lack of significant coverage in independent sources. However, a couple days ago on the Help Desk, I had an indication from StarryGrandma that notability criteria are altered for academics. Wikipedia:Notability (academics)

Specifically, the subject, Samuel Krimm, has won an American Physical Society prize, and is listed in Wikipedia as being elected to APS in 1959: List of fellows of the American Physical Society (1921–1971)#1959

StarryGrandma wrote: "He is definitely notable enough for an article since he was elected a fellow of the American Physical Society in 1959. His name is already in Wikipedia on the list of fellows here. A reference for that award is the database at the APS website. That same database reports that he received the Polymer Physics Prize in 1977 for "his outstanding experimental studies and theoretical developments in infrared and Ra-man spectroscopy and X-ray scattering from natural and synthetic polymers". Material published on the University website, including his curriculum vitae is fine for facts about him. Biographical coverage in newspapers is not expected but can be very helpful." Wikipedia:Help desk#c-StarryGrandma-20240826052500-Philscijazz-20240826042000

So, I'm uncertain if anything can be done. It's definitely true that there has never been an independent biography of Krimm, but it seemed to me that StarryGrandma was saying this particular requirement was not as strong for academics, especially those who have won prestigious prizes (in Krimm's case, APS Polymer Physics prize in 1977, and Humboldt Prize in 1983, both are included in the draft article).

If StarryGrandma was wrong about this, then I'm stuck. If not, should I try resubmitting with some special flag as to academic status?

Also, I just edited the draft to add mention of his supervision of Willie Hobbs Moore for her PhD (she is listed in Wikipedia at Willie Hobbs Moore. Is that at all helpful?

Thanks for your guidance. Philscijazz (talk) 01:26, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I should note that Krimm satisfies criteria 2 and 3 of the academic notability requirements:

2. The person has received a highly prestigious academic award or honor at a national or international level. (APS 1977, Humboldt 1983)

3. The person has been an elected member of a highly selective and prestigious scholarly society or association... (APS 1959) Philscijazz (talk) 01:30, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

He can certainly qualify for an article under Wikipedia's notability guidelines, but the article needs other criteria to be met in order to be 'promoted' from draft to article. In this case the references used to back up various claims, such as his professor emeritus and other education credentials, need to come from a published source other than Samuel Krimm's own works and CV. I will note that I can see why you're having trouble in this regard, it's tough finding sources on the Internet, and most of the contemporary Fellows of the American Physical Society have their biographies supported by obituaries... Reconrabbit 01:48, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

If there is some sort of official source at UMich (and prior institutions) that can establish his credentials, would that suffice?

For example, if Princeton has a listing of his MS/PhD? If NYU/Tandon has a listing from Brooklyn Poly for his BS?

There are definitely original sources for his APS and Humboldt prizes (I've linked them in the draft).

Would be great to get this included before he dies... Philscijazz (talk) 01:56, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Specifically, can I use his faculty listing pages at the university to verify that he is indeed an emeritus professor and research scientist there?

https://lsa.umich.edu/physics/people/emeritus/skrimm.html

https://lsa.umich.edu/biophysics/people/emeritus/skrimm.html

Can his educational summary on a university faculty page validate his undergrad and grad degrees?

https://macro.engin.umich.edu/profile/krimm-samuel/

If I can piece together the main items from the CV without referring to the CV, will that work, and are these considered reliable enough sources?

Is the following history link sufficient to verify that he was the first Director of the Program in Protein Structure and Design in 1985 (scroll to final paragraph)?

https://lsa.umich.edu/biophysics/about-us/biophysics-history.html

If these items were all sufficiently reliable, and I removed the remaining items/sections cited by the CV, would there be enough substance remaining to pass muster? Philscijazz (talk) 06:21, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Oh, and if the list of publications is not acceptable, would his ResearchGate listing be okay as a replacement, to demonstrate that he is a serious researcher and publisher of peer-reviewed work?

https://www.researchgate.net/scientific-contributions/Samuel-Krimm-15083197 Philscijazz (talk) 06:24, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Also, just to confirm: this from StarryGrandma was incorrect?

"Material published on the University website, including his curriculum vitae is fine for facts about him." Philscijazz (talk) 02:00, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

This document was brought to my attention by a fellow editor and will be of use in improving the sourcing: https://apps.lib.umich.edu/faculty-memoir/apps.lib.umich.edu/faculty-memoir/faculty/samuel-krimm.html Reconrabbit 23:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that's a great summary, but it was self-written by the subject, thus I assumed not an independent source. So I declined to use that as a primary source.

I mean, he is a straight-up honorable guy and I doubt there is anything in there that isn't true. But if a CV is not independent enough, then this memoir (including his self-bio, even if written in the third person) probably isn't, either.

In any case, I just resubmitted the draft, removing all the CV-only citations, and will be relying on the awards and APS fellowship to qualify as academically notable, and all other citations are independent primary sources. Hope it gets approved.

If, later on, anyone wants to add CV-related stuff, or stuff from the memoir, by all means have at it. But due to my declared COI (I'm his son), I won't be involved in that myself, except perhaps on an advisory/suggestive basis. I certainly understand that I won't be making subsequent edits directly. Philscijazz (talk) 00:01, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Any interesting statement that isn't traceable to a reliable third-party publication is likely to be quickly removed from the article. In any situation where an unscrupulous subject could potentially be stretching the truth, we need a reporter's opinion, not the subject's opinion. This means only the very most boring material from a memoir (i.e. bare statements of uncontroversial fact) is even potentially usable. TooManyFingers (talk) 05:38, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

One might even say that a Wikipedia biography is just a survey of the published literature on that person, with the exception that any literature not independent from the subject is excluded. TooManyFingers (talk) 05:43, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, the article is now live in the mainspace, so my personal involvement is basically over.

A few folks have indicated that primary-source standards are somewhat relaxed for academic figures, especially academics who satisfy the special academic notability criteria (like prestigious awards and exclusive professional societies, such as American Physical Society in this case - he has been wikilinked from the APS fellow page for quite some time, with a missing page until now).

In any case, I removed the CV-only references before resubmitting it. The memoir link above seems to have been used only for birthdate and birthplace info. Philscijazz (talk) 05:53, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Probably time to archive this thread? (I don't know how to do that, or even if I have authority to do it.) Sorry for the multiple queries in different help spaces, I was a newbie anxious to get answers for my questions, and not sure about response patterns. The page is in mainspace and this question seems moot at this point. Thanks for everyone's feedback. Philscijazz (talk) 06:03, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Threads are archived after a few days once comments stop being added. No action needed on your part, it's done by an automated process. Reconrabbit 13:32, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Creating a Wiki page

I wish to create a Wiki page about myself so that information is easily available to others. Can I do it? Can I prepare a draft and submit it to the Wiki team for verification? AgnihotriRK (talk) 03:27, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

AgnihotriRK, information about yourself will be easily available to others, and can be exactly as you wish, if you put it on your own website. Attempting to do so on Wikipedia will very likely fail; and whether it fails or passes, will probably waste a lot of your and others' time. If you're notable, others will want to create an article about you, with no prodding (let alone payment) from you. -- Hoary (talk) 04:45, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

To elaborate, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not social media. Attempts at autobiography almost always fail (see WP:AUTO). Unless people with no connection to you have published articles about you that can be valid references (see WP:42), you will fail, having just wasted the time of a Reviewer. If you truely believe you are Wilipedia-notable, see WP:YFA fpr the process. David notMD (talk) 08:41, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Comma in page title

There is currently a page for an album titled "In case I make it," with improper title casing. WP:AT states that the quotation marks are fine but I can't find anything that talks about commas, so I'm unsure if I should move this page to either "In Case I Make It" or "In Case I Make It,". Koopastar (talk) 03:41, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

The quotes and comma seem reasonable here since it is the official album name. Amazon link. This might be a good question for the article talk page though. Talk:"In case I make it," Then folks that have the article watchlisted can weigh in. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:22, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Koopastar: Why do you think it has improper title casing? We omit capitalization of certain words but if the official title does not have a capital then I don't think we add it. Compare "In case I make it," and Everything Is A Lot at the official site. They deliberately omit capitals in the first, probably to make it look like a quoted text. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:03, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I was just going off of other album pages that capitalize a lowercase title such as The First Glass Beach Album, but if the quotations and selected capitalization make it exempt then I'd be fine leaving it as-is. Koopastar (talk) 16:17, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Frustrated and need help :(

For the record, I don't wish to get them blocked or punished. But I have difficulty in getting through to at least two editors in which I cant even tell if they are gaslighting me or genuinely misunderstand a common term, and do not wish to go through a protracted edit war over something so absurd.

When the media says that China and the USA both "topped the gold medal chart,"[4] it obviously mean that both countries won the same number of gold medals, placing them at the top of the ranking based on gold medals won. In this context, "topped" refers specifically to being equal in the number of gold medals, without considering other factors like silver or bronze medals.[5]

Yet one editor refuses to accept that Gold medal chart only counts golds. They claim that it also counts silvers and bronze and hence argue that China must come second on gold medal count/chart. I tried to explain it to them but fail.[6] I tried to reach out to noticeboards in the past but nobody responds and I am always basically handling them myself mostly alone on talk page. I know I can just cite Wikipedia policies and state that the info is sourced but expect they will just revert it.

I am noobish with how to resolve disputes best on Wikipedia. I get there's a process but there should be an easier way to resolve this, in which I am clearly not aware of. Evibeforpoli (talk) 03:48, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

If the media say, or if just one medium says, that X and Y both topped Z, this doesn't obviously mean to me that they topped it with a tie. Perhaps their positions were 1st and 2nd, or perhaps they were 2nd and 1st. Perhaps the thrust of what you're saying is correct, but it's hardly helped by use of "obviously". -- Hoary (talk) 04:52, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Hoary I don't really understand much of your comment but are you suggesting that China and USA did not tie on gold medal count? A lot of media is saying that because it's undeniable. And perhaps the use of the specific word, "obviously" is inappropriate but I don't mean anything personal about it. I understand Wikipedia to be a platform for neutral, verifiable information. And that info is just supported by numerous reliable sources and is verifiable. Regardless I will try the dispute resolution process and thank you for the feedback. Evibeforpoli (talk) 21:18, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Evibeforpoli, you said that "When the media [say] that [P], it obviously [means] [Q]." I merely said that, for me at least, although P may mean Q it doesn't obviously mean Q; rather, Q is one possible interpretation. Though actually you were asserting something not about abstractions but instead about a claim made for medals won by two nations during the most recent Olympic games; and a writer or speaker's understanding of the facts shown in 2024 Summer Olympics medal table would indeed constrain the possibilities. But this is all rather beside the way. Just follow Pigs' excellent advice (immediately below). -- Hoary (talk) 22:39, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Evibeforpoli: Please follow the process at WP:DR. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:43, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Pigsonthewing I don’t wish to escalate it yet on the talk thread, I get heated accusations that I am deliberately ignoring info despite the irony. And it’s just difficult to continue such a discussion on talk when instead of just focusing on evidence and policies, I cop a lot of such flak. I came here looking for some knowledgable neutral third party to mediate because if I continue to discuss with them on talk, it’s difficult to be professional about it. And I was hoping that you recommend me to a neutral third party that is willing to intervene but perhaps that could be found in Dispute resolution noticeboard?? But I don't believe I have ever tried them so will give it a go. Thanks for the tip.Evibeforpoli (talk) 20:58, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

That's my "signature" (or "sig"); it's appended to all of my talk page posts, as yours is to your posts. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:23, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

reliable reference

Hello, would declassifieduk.org be considered a good source? Thank you. CircleJump (talk) 05:27, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I would assume so, given it has its own page at Declassified UK. Koopastar (talk) 05:56, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Having its own article is irrelevant. There are plenty of unreliable sources with their own Wikipedia articles. Shantavira|^{feed me} 10:08, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@CircleJump Welcome! For the future, we have a specific place for questions like that, WP:RSN. It has an archive to search in, and there I found Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_437#Declassified_UK. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 06:36, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion criteria

A quick question...

An article is created by a user who is later blocked from editing that article due to disruptive editing and COI. The article is subsequently deleted at AfD. Several weeks later the blocked editor recreates the article and places it directly into mainspace.

Is the article best nominated for speedy deletion under WP:G4 (recreation of a deleted article), WP:G5 (recreation by a banned/blocked user, or in violation of general sanctions), or under both criteria?

Any help gratefully appreciated. Axad12 (talk) 06:08, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Please consider dropping some links to the article, editor, etc. Will be easier to answer this with more details. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:16, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

This is the article [7].

The previous AfD is here [8]

I opted for G4, but in hindsight I suspect that G5 would have been more straightforward. Axad12 (talk) 07:24, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

They appear to be partially blocked from that page but are still able to edit it somehow. Weird. I've started Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)#Partially blocked user still able to edit page? to discuss the technical side of this. Let me investigate a bit more before deciding if I can CSD this... –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:35, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I decided to WP:G4 it. The content was pretty similar to the deleted version. I will also ping Star Mississippi and let them know about this block evasion. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:38, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Many thanks. Is it worth salting the article? The user has a clear COI and an apparent disregard for policies and guidelines. For example, the article was also nominated under G4, by another user, when it was still in draft stage, leading to the COI user recreating it in a different sandbox to avoid deletion (the G4 was actually turned down at that point due to it still being a draft). The whole saga just looks like a series of bad faith actions to me. Axad12 (talk) 07:47, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Good idea. Salted indefinitely, extended confirmed. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:58, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Escape the Fate

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Escape_the_Fate&diff=prev&oldid=480381331

User:Panic Reaper tried to condense a section in Escape the Fate in 2012 and goofed up the citations. I think I've tracked down the problem, but then I ran out of steam. Can someone help (to really mix a metaphor) untangle this mess? Snowman304|talk 06:51, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Dictatorship or Autocratic?

Namaste, I recently read an article about Sheikh Hasina, the former Prime Minister of Bangladesh. I noticed that the word "dictatorship" was used in her introduction. "Dictatorship" seems like a strong word for a democratically elected leader. While I agree that she has used power to manipulate election results by controlling the media and arresting opposition, I believe she is more authoritarian than a dictator. In my opinion, using words like "dictatorship" would be more appropriate for countries like Saudi Arabia, Yemen, or China, but not here. It feels biased and inaccurate to me.

As a newcomer, I am unable to edit the page, and I haven't received a response from another experienced editor on the talk page. I posted this here to see if someone can edit the page or tell me whether "dictatorship" or "authoritarian" is the correct word. Thanks राजकुमार^(talk) 07:31, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Being democratically elected doesn't preclude someone from being a dictator, Hitler was democratically elected. What matters, however, is the terminology that the majority of independent reliable sources use. You just posted on the talk page yesterday- you should give more time for people to respond. 331dot (talk) 07:35, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

It's a bit more complicated with Hitler...he managed to circumvent the checks and balances in the Weimar Constitution after he was appointed chancellor; see also Enabling Act of 1933. Lectonar (talk) 12:38, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

A softer example could be Lee Kuan Yew who despite being labelled as a dictator by some, was an elected politician for a long time. – robertsky (talk) 16:40, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Generic name error for IMDb Editors

I was just curious how I could fix this problem for my sources since IMDb doesn't give the full names of its editors. Thank you for your help Zombiezilla (talk) 08:08, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello. You shouldn't be using IMDB as a source at all, as it is user-editable. 331dot (talk) 08:11, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Ok thanks! Zombiezilla (talk) 08:17, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Zombiezilla: See also WP:IMDb. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:21, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you so much! I changed the sources so IMDb isn't used. Zombiezilla (talk) 16:54, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

What can I add?

I specifically joined to make an edit to the page about a Latin Phrase, De gustibus non est disputandum, because I believe I have found the earliest usage of the phrase, which clarifies its intended meaning. No other authority provides any cited instance.

Needless to say, the context is in Latin, so some sort of English précis seemed essential. This was of course deleted as "original research"; as was my contention that it was the first known instance. I did also provide some emphasis on the contextual meaning of the phrase; but it hardly constituted a personal philosophical opinion that might disputed.

The onus to prove that there isn't an earlier instance -- when all other authorities have failed to provide any -- seems impossibly high.

I was also told that "secondary/tertiary sources are preferred to primary sources", which seems an odd way of ensuring accuracy and factual integrity.

Given that the article already contained summations and interpretations of the meaning of the phrase, without citation, it all seemed a bit much.

And if we want to add original research, do we just publish it on our own websites and then cite it here? It's a small enough nugget that no journal will publish it as an article.

Thanks Benwiggy1 (talk) 14:41, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Helloo, Benwiggy1, and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm afraid that Wikipedia is absolutely not the place to do what you are trying to do.

A Wikipedia article should summarise what reliable published sources have said on a subject: that is all. Original research is not accepted, and nor is information from non-reliable sources.

So, in answer to your last question: publish it on your website by all means, but that cannot be cited in Wikipedia. Write a book/article/paper on it that gets published by a reputable publisher, and then Wikipedia can cite it.

Sorry. ColinFine (talk) 15:47, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Is the primary source "non-reliable"?

This page gives a summary of content in a foreign language.

Complaint tablet to Ea-nāṣir Benwiggy1 (talk) 09:40, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Benwiggy1, the maxim may be Latin, but it's conspicuous within English: as one writer famously glosses it: "there is no disputing against HOBBY-HORSES". So perhaps Notes and Queries would find space for your very short paper (or your squib, as I've seen such things called). -- Hoary (talk) 09:09, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

On the fence about creating a page

I want to make a page about the 2016 racing game called BallisticNG but I am not sure if it is notable enough. It can average about 10 concurrent players according to SteamCharts, and has a small but dedicated community and is still receiving support from the developers, but it appeals to such a niche audience that it might not be worth the Wikipedia server space to write a page about it. Another similar game called Redout has its own article while having an even smaller playerbase, which makes me think it would be okay to make a BallisticNG page. One problem I already encountered was sources, since the only websites with any information about it aside from YouTube, the BallisticNG game wiki, and the developer's website are niche/independent game journalism sites. ApteryxRainWing (talk) 14:54, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@ApteryxRainWing Wikipedia is not short of server space and has many articles on niche topics (see WP:WHAAOE). However, you have identified the issue: we only accept articles on notable topics, which means there must be published sources meeting all of these criteria. It sounds as if it may be WP:TOOSOON for this particular game. Read this essay for one approach to writing an article. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:03, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. The game is receiving its final update soon with possible console releases so I'll wait until then and hope someone like PCgamer or the PlayStation Blog reports on it, then reevaluate if it needs an article based off player counts and online discussion ApteryxRainWing (talk) 15:18, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

You can't decide based on player counts or online discussions, only on how much published reporting it gets from reporters who don't have any reason to care about it. Example: if there's a terrible unpopular game that only three people ever played, but it gets described on CNN news and all the newspapers write about it, it gets on Wikipedia. But if there's a great game with millions of players and no big reporters ever write stories about it, Wikipedia won't touch it. TooManyFingers (talk) 18:00, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Bare pdf references

Hi to everyone, I am trying to fill up a couple of bare references with pdf but I did not understand how to do it. Could someone help me with these? Best wishes. Nihaon (talk) 15:03, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Nihaon: Please clarify what you mean by filling with pdf? RudolfRed (talk) 15:54, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you a lot. In this article Empathism - Wikipedia I have used Refill program to insert correct references. If you check it you will notice there are two references that are still marked as "bare references". In fact the Refill program is not working with these two... I do not know if you could tell me how to do it and if possible to fill up these two references.

Thanks a lot. Nihaon (talk) 15:58, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

ReFill doesn't work with PDF bare URLs. You'll have to fill out the citations manually. C F A 💬 16:57, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Nihaon. I'm not surprised that ReFill couldn't work on those, because the required information is not apparent.

Your citation 128 is to a commercial page advertising a publication. If you mean to cite that publication, then you must provide the author, title, publisher, date, page: they are not apparent on the site you linked to, so ReFill can do nothing.

108 appears to be a download of a PDF from a government department. Again, there is no way ReFill can determine the necessary bibliographic information (and indeed, I'm wondering whether it is really "published"). ColinFine (talk) 17:01, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

valdalism

Hi, someone has completely replaced the information on a Wiki page: Nailstone, with various foreign language edits. There appears to be no history left so I'm not sure what to do? Velvetfreak (talk) 17:42, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

https://ceb.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nailstone. Velvetfreak (talk) 17:43, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

That is a foreign langage Wikipedia. perhaps you are looking for Nailstone? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.238.235.108 (talk) 17:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

That is the Cebuano Wikipedia which is unusual in that it contains millions of articles machine translated by Lsjbot. Cullen328 (talk) 18:04, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Cullen328 That's wack. Alexysun (talk) 18:29, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Alexysun, each language project is independent and sets its own policies and guidelines. The Cebuano Wikipedia is definitely an outlier when it comes to permitting machine translations. Cullen328 (talk) 18:42, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

How do you edit the "On this day" section on the homepage?

How do you edit the "On this day" section on the homepage? Alexysun (talk) 18:29, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Only admins can edit the main page. Nevertheless, the info on the main page is usually crowdsourced on subpages by non admins, then put into queues by admins. The on this day subpage is at WP:OTD, I think. –Novem Linguae (talk) 18:41, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Novem Linguae Thanks. Alexysun (talk) 23:20, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Creating a user page

I'm new here and trying to set up my user page and have so many questions. Is the user page the same as my home page? Is the User page meant to be conversational not informational? Cynthia Wells (talk) 18:39, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

User pages such as User:Cynthia Wells are meant to be informational. Every page on Wikipedia is also paired with a talk page, which is meant to be conversational. In this case, the conversational user talk page is User talk:Cynthia Wells. If you get a message at User talk:Cynthia Wells, the software will alert you with a ping (and if unread for long enough, an email), since this is a primary way to communicate directly with other users.

Special:Homepage is something different than the above two mentioned pages. That is a hidden page that only you can see, and gives new editors ideas of things to work on. Hope this helps. –Novem Linguae (talk) 18:44, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you!  Cynthia Wells (talk) 21:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Cynthia Wells You can learn a lot about what you can put on your user page by looking at other people's, they are informational though. Some people use theirs to redirect to their talk page, opting not to have a user page at all, some use them to explain a bit about themselves and some use it to show off their wikibling; a totally made up word for barnstars, service awards (basically just editing and time milestones]] or things that they're proud of, like Good Articles, Did You Know entries, stuff like that.

People can get quite creative with it too, @Chaotic Enby comes to mind.

There is a style guide as well if you want some more inspiration, which you can find here. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 18:48, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Cynthia Wells. The purpose of a user page is for a Wikipedia editor to inform other Wikipedia editors about their interests, accomplishments and plans as a Wikipedia editor. A small amount of personal information is OK, as long as it is not promotional. So, informational not conversational. User talk pages are for conversations about the encyclopedia. Cullen328 (talk) 18:49, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Yep, I'm here! Ready to help if you have any questions. The user page is mostly informational (and you can indeed get very creative with it!), while your user talk page (User talk:Cynthia Wells or User talk:Chaotic Enby) is the more conversational and practical one. Chaotic Enby (talk · contribs) 18:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Adding that, as Cullen328 said, a user page is mostly informational in the context of Wikipedia editing, although some personal information is okay. For instance, my user page has the languages I speak and pronouns I use, alongside a bunch of Wikipedia-related stuff (tools, WikiProjects, etc.). Other user pages might have more personal information to help know the person, or none at all – provided you're careful with your online info, and don't look like you're trying to webhost a full biography or pass off your user page as an encyclopedia article, it's fine! Chaotic Enby (talk · contribs) 19:11, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you all who replied!  Cynthia Wells (talk) 21:52, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! Cynthia Wells (talk) 21:51, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! Cynthia Wells (talk) 21:50, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

copyright license question

So Oman's government has an Open Government license (OGL-om) which essentially mean all literary, artistic, and scientific works posted by the government or any entity where the government owns 40%>= can be used for any commercial or non commercial purpose. But I am not sure about the official pictures of the Head of State (past and present) as I read somewhere that their pictures are copyrighted but I cant find that reference again. Since the license says all media posted by the government is freeuse do I assume the pictures of the Head of State are under that umbrella? Thanks CircleJump (talk) 18:57, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I have attempted to contact the government entities responsible for the license but they havent been any help.. CircleJump (talk) 19:04, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

i would personally say that if they explicitly say that all pictures are up for use and are not copyrighted then your picture of the head of state would be free to use. Stuuf7 (talk) 23:24, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@CircleJump: according to the template, the licence does not apply in the case of Data protected by copyright and neighbouring rights owned by a third party.

If the photos are copyright by a third party, then the licence does not apply.

I suggest you ask at Commons:Village_pump/Copyright and provide more information on the specific photo(s) you are interested in. RudolfRed (talk) 01:42, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Adding a translation by another author

Hi, I want to add an English article to an already existing German entry "Markus Redl" in de.wikipedia.org/wiki/. The text was translated into English by another author, how can I proceed? Thanks! Marie Gruber cetc (talk) 19:38, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Marie Gruber cetc, and welcome to the Teahouse. Please see Translation.

Note that to be accepted, the translation must have adequate citations to show that the subject meets English Wikipedia's criteria for notability. It doesn't look to me as if any of the sources cited in de:Markus Redl are independent of Redl, and therefore none of them will contribute to establishing notability. You will need to find several sources which meet the criteria in WP:42 (they do not have to be in English, or available online), and base the article on what those sources say, not on what you know or, necessarily, on what the de-wiki article says. ColinFine (talk) 21:22, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi ColinFine, thanks for your help and advice! Marie Gruber cetc (talk) 11:49, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Faculty pages at university website to establish faculty status

In lieu of using a CV for citation, is it acceptable to cite official faculty pages at a university website to establish faculty status at the university? (In the particular case I'm working on, it's emeritus faculty status.)

Draft:Samuel Krimm

I've left the CV citations in there for now, but if I removed all items cited by the CV and just left the other items/sections, would that be substantive enough to resubmit? Philscijazz (talk) 19:44, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Philscijazz, and welcome to the Teahouse. Such sources are primary sources, and can be cited for limited uncontroversial factual information, but do not contribute to establishing that the subject meets the criteria for notability. ColinFine (talk) 21:25, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

If there isn't a general biography, can a page be submitted as a stub

Draft:Samuel Krimm

Krimm is already mentioned in two places in Wikipedia:

List of fellows of the American Physical Society (1921–1971)#1959

Willie Hobbs Moore

If CV sections are removed from this draft, is there enough there to make a stub? Philscijazz (talk) 20:24, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello again, Philscijazz. A stub requires the same level of sourcing - to establish that the subject is notable in Wikipedia terms.

(My personal view is that stubs are a historical feature from the early days of Wikipedia, which are unfortunately still around in significant numbers. Given that no draft article will be accepted without suitable sourcing, and editors are encouraged to develop drafts in Draft space, I don't see any reason why a single new stub should be added to the encyclopaedia). ColinFine (talk) 21:28, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, he is an academic who satisfies criteria 2 and 3 of academic notability:

Wikipedia:Notability (academics)

2. He won an APS prize in 1977, and a Humboldt prize in 1983

3. He was elected as a fellow to APS in 1959

He is already mentioned in two Wikipedia pages:

List of fellows of the American Physical Society (1921–1971)#1959

Willie Hobbs Moore

The idea would be that those mentions could link to a page rather than remain unlinked.

I mean, I suppose I could resubmit it and hope for the best, and if declined then have to wait for an obit (hopefully still a few years off).

If I do resubmit it, is there a way I can include pointers to these details to pay attention to in reviewing the submission? Philscijazz (talk) 21:47, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Clarification on Notability and Proper Citations for a Publicly Traded Company

Hi everyone! I’ve recently created a Wikipedia article for a publicly traded company where I’m employed. I’ve disclosed my connection on the article’s talk page and have done my best to write it in a neutral tone. I’ve also used citations from reputable sources like Yahoo Finance, SEC.gov, and Businesswire rather than anything directly from the company itself. However, I’m aware that being publicly traded doesn’t automatically grant notability on Wikipedia. I’m looking for advice on how to ensure the article meets Wikipedia’s notability criteria, especially for publicly traded companies. Are there specific types of sources or coverage I should focus on? Also, if an article lacks sufficient references initially, but the company is likely notable, what’s the best approach to avoid it being nominated for deletion? Any guidance would be greatly appreciated, especially since I’m still learning the ropes! Samlee1890 (talk) 21:00, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Courtesy link User:Samlee1890/sandbox the draft is blatant advertising, telling us everything the company wants us to know about themselves. Wikipedia is only interested in what reliable, independent sources have reported. Theroadislong (talk) 21:08, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

That makes sense. Thank you for the clarification. Samlee1890 (talk) 02:14, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello. You wrote your disclosure as part of your draft; instead you should disclose on your user page.

I'm afraid that you have a common, fundamental misunderstanding as to what it is we do here. Wikipedia is not a place for businesses to tell about themselves, their offerings, and what they consider to be their own history. A Wikipedia article about a business muat summarize what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about the business, showing how it meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable business. Your draft is sourced exclusively to primary sources. We don't want to know what the company says about itself, we want to know what others choose on their own to say about it. 331dot (talk) 21:09, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I haven't looked at the draft. But I do note I’ve also used citations from reputable sources like Yahoo Finance, SEC.gov, and Businesswire, above. The article Business Wire starts by telling us that it's an American company that disseminates full-text press releases from thousands of companies and organizations worldwide to news media, financial markets, disclosure systems, investors, information web sites, databases, bloggers, social networks and other audiences. This suggests that it simply regurgitates what the company feeds it. "Reputable" would have to be qualified. -- Hoary (talk) 22:48, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Samlee1890, I agree with the assessment of other editors here. In its current form, your draft is pretty much the opposite of an acceptable Wikipedia article about a company. A Wikipedia article should summarize what multiple reliable sources completely independent of the company say about the company, and those sources should devote significant coverage to that company. The applicable guideline is Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies). Cullen328 (talk) 23:30, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

The Yahoo Finance source is just a reprint of a company press release. It does not even pretend to be independent reporting. Cullen328 (talk) 23:34, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I also agree with the assessment others have made about the draft especially what Cullen is saying about the current form being the opposite of an acceptable article with the exception of one tiny little thing I beg to differ with him on and that is this idea that reprinting press releases makes a source no longer independent and what would be more correct is this makes the source a primary one and not secondary. To be a non-independent source would require some kind of legal or monetary connection between the subject and source, but simply reprinting press releases is not enough to prove this kind of connection between the subject and Yahoo Finance or between Yahoo Finance and any of the many subjects they may or may not choose to reprint press releases on. That doesn't make them any less reliable or prove they are in cahoots with any of the subjects they report on. It simply means they decided to do some lazy reporting. Fast and easy money. That's how the kids are doing it these days am I right? My take on it is that reliable sources like Yahoo Finance don't have to pretend to be independent because they are. I think what Cullen is getting at here though is the same basic end result that the article needs to have reliable secondary sourcing with "significant coverage" that goes beyond just a reprint of the press release. We are just arriving to the same destination in different vehicles I guess... lol Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 23:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Actually, I took a closer look at the Yahoo Finance source and it seems fine to me, but you should find some better ones. I thought it was just a press release reprint, but only the first paragraph was reprinted. The rest of the article was significant analytical coverage. You have only one just barely secondary source for the article and the disclosure absolutely should not be "viewable to the public" or going live. Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 23:38, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

In addition to what others have said, the NASDAQ source is just a list of their regulatory filings.

I've been looking but there's been very little significant coverage that would be sufficient create an encyclopedia entry. Perhaps the Bloomberg Law piece on a lawsuit against the company and an investor for an alleged buyback scheme, but certainly not enough by itself. CoffeeCrumbs (talk) 23:52, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm understanding now that the article must be a culmination of what outside reputable sources state. Thank you. Samlee1890 (talk) 02:15, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello @Samlee1890,In addition to what other contributors has said. It's neccesary you summarise your article and write in neutral point of view, I imagine how difficult that would be seeing you work with them.

Also, I think it's neccesary you create a userpage (Your name is still appearing in red linking, you deserve the blue tick!). Tesleemah (talk) 01:39, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Tesleemah, creating a userpage is not a requirement for anyone - many long term editors prefer to keep that redlinked. In this case, since the OP has a COI, their userpage is the easiest place to put a COI declaration, but it's not required of them as long as they declare properly some other way. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 13:43, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Why can't Lily Hoshikawa page be edited?

Why can't I change Lily Hoshikawa's gender to cisgender male to match the Japanese official sources since a user named Bridget-chan said that "Lily Hoshikawa is a trans girl" is a headcanon and Headcanons should not belong in Wikipedia. But why can't I edit that Lily Hoshikawa page? Because it had to do with vandalism or something? 103.186.35.26 (talk) 05:03, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

You have asked this question before, and the answer is unlikely to change. Tollens (talk) 05:13, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Basing what you say on a reliable source that you specify, describe the change that you want. Write on the article's talk page. Be precise. If you're persuasive, another editor will implement your suggestion. 126.208.212.39 (talk) 05:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Ferret: It seems like you might find this one familiar. Tollens (talk) 05:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

(edit conflict) The Lily Hoshikawa was semi-protected due to persistent disruptive editing problems. If you go to the article, click on "View History" and then click on "View logs for this page", you should see which administrator protected the page, why they protected the page and how long they protected it for. FWIW, the page can currently be edited by WP:AUTOCONFIRMED accounts, but not WP:IP accounts. So, you can either (1) create an WP:ACCOUNT and edit the article after your account achieves autoconfirmed status, or (2) make an edit request at Talk:Lily Hoshikawa. Regardless of what you decide to do, you're going to need to make sure whatever change you make satisfies relevant policies and guidelines, which is this case means Wikipedia:Verifiablity. If the sources cited in the Japanese Wikipedia article satisfy Wikipedia:RELIABLESOURCE, then you can use them; you should, though, be a bit careful because lots of the sources cited in articles on other language Wikipedias aren't always very good or otherwise considered acceptable for English Wikipedia. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:26, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Marchjuly@Tollens This is an LTA. Blocked. -- ferret (talk) 13:14, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks – thought so but wasn't certain. Tollens (talk) 17:48, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Unable to Publish an article

Hi Team, My name is Gulshan Pandey. I am working on an article about an Indian politician named Tarun Chugh. Unfortunately, it has been deleted or moved to draft several times, and I am unsure what mistakes I am making. Previously, I created the page for "Sonawari Assembly constituency," which was published on the first attempt, but this time I am having difficulty getting the article published. I have included many prominent media links as references. Could you please suggest what I should do to ensure the article meets the necessary standards? Thank you for your assistance. Best regards, Gulshan Pandey Gulshan99 (talk) 06:56, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Gulshan99: I have already answered this at the AfC help desk. Please don't ask the same question in several places. Thanks, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 07:32, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Much of the content is not referenced. Either reference or delete. And it looks like a CV, not an encyclopedia article. And the refs should not be URLs. David notMD (talk) 11:56, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

All of his political career has been appointments to party positions, i.e., not elected to government positions, so very unlikely that he rises to Wikipedia notability. David notMD (talk) 13:37, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Bots creation/integration

Hi, I'm fascinated about the WikiBots. I just want to know how these are built and, how these are being operated. Do I need programming languages to build these or simple wiki markups.?

One more thing, Could I able to integrate with my user profile for a certain task.? If yes, then how.? Thanks. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 11:54, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi Perfectodefecto. Bots require programming and approval. See Wikipedia:Bots. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:59, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Got it. May I know, which programming language do they use primarily to create the bots.?

I do have a little experience in ChatBots creation, that's why I asked. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 12:23, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Perfectodefecto: Python is the most common and has a framework to help. See Help:Creating a bot#Reuse codebase. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:04, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Got them. Last question...

Are there any sample codes available on GitHub currently.? asking for, to have a reference point.

If no, where should I search.?

Many Thanks. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 13:24, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Got them on GitHub... Thanks a lot. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 13:33, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm not getting an edit tab

I'd like to make a small edit, but there's no edit tab in sight.

I'm signed in. What can I do? I'm willing to start another account if need be.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamlet Wordsoutloud (talk) 14:01, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Wordsoutloud You won't be able to, it's semi-protected. This is a protection level used on Wikipedia that prevents registered users with less than 10 edits and 4 days on Wikipedia from editing. It also prevents all IP users from editing the articles. You can see the protection level of an article at the very top on the right. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 14:09, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Wordsoutloud, if you click on View source at the top of the article, you'll get instructions on how to submit an edit request and a blue button to click when you're ready to do that. Or you can make useful edits in other places until you meet the requirements to edit that article. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 14:21, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. I've put my proposed edit on the Talk page. I'm not even sure whether it's small edit. It's just a line, but it's more than correcting a typo.

I'm beginning to think the world can live without finding out about "Four Ghosts in Hamlet" by Fritz Leiber. Wordsoutloud (talk) 14:37, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Struggles with first post

Hello Teahouse community,

I've attempted for several months to create a wiki page for a friend of mine who's a rising boxing star(Robin "Robz" Safar) and recently had his breakthrough fight in Saudi Arabia. However, I've made over 10 edits and have gotten rejected every time. I've used a neutral approach to it all to make sure it's not seen as promotional and I've also provided sources for everything. The most recent submission has now been pending for close to 5 months and I'm not quite sure as to why it's taking so long for something very minor, just for informational purpose to help the boxers future potential fans read about him; and also those who are curious. I'm a bit lost and would appreciate any assistance greatly!

Wish you all a blessed day.

Sincerely,

Malik & Team Robz Robin Safar (talk) 14:15, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Robin Safar. Note that if you are not Robin Safar, you should not be using his name as your username. You should also read WP:COI and make sure you comply with the requirements. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 14:24, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Malik. "to help the boxers future potential fans read about him" is called promotion, and is forbidden anywhere on Wikipedia. ColinFine (talk) 15:31, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

To add to the above, Wikipedia articles doesn't have articles on anyone who is up-and-coming. They must have already arrived. So, no rising stars, because it's WP:TOOSOON for Wikipedia. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:23, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Editing

I heard I can get help editing here. My article won't get accepted. Kudzuboss123 (talk) 14:20, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Kudzuboss123 Currently the article has no sources. This is a major issue, without any sources it will never be accepted. Additionally, upon searching for some sources for you I couldn't find any. Due to that, I'd advise that you put that article on the backburner for now until it has some sources, instead doing some tasks to build up your experience on Wikipedia. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 14:25, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Kudzuboss123, welcome to the Teahouse. Please stop resubmitting the draft; without reliable sources, it will not be accepted, and if you persist it may eventually be rejected, which is the end of the line. Also, you seem to have a conflict of interest here - please read WP:COI. 57.140.16.35 (talk) 14:27, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello Kudzuboss123. After looking over Draft: Nightshift at Barry's I thought it might be helpful for you to study Help:Referencing for beginners and Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources. Encyclopedia articles are not posted in order promote anything, articles inform people about what reliable references, not connected to the article subject, have to say about the article subject. Also “Officially written by Kudzuboss 123 himself” is not appropriate. If you look at other Wikipedia articles you will see that the writer never gets a byline. Articles are written anonymously, and others are free to come along later and make any edits that improve the article. Best wishes on your future Wikipedia projects. Karenthewriter (talk) 16:24, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks so if I remove it will it get approved? Kudzuboss123 (talk) 22:02, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

When Kudzuboss123 himself has written the article, that proves that the article is worthless. Everyone knows he is going to lie to make himself look good.

To be a good article, we have to prove that it DOESN'T come from Kudzuboss123. We need to be able to show that all the words in the article come from people who don't know him and are not his friends or employees. TooManyFingers (talk) 17:41, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Ok thanks, I understand. Do you think that would fix it and get it approved? Kudzuboss123 (talk) 22:01, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I doubt it. I think you should give up on it, unless you can write it forward instead of backward. Read WP:BACKWARD (really, read it), you went about it all wrong. You should start over from scratch, finding reliable sources that are independent of you first before you write even a single word. See WP:Golden Rule (and memorize the three criteria) for the sources required. Every sentence you write must be verifiable in a reliable source. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:21, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

If no one has published about the game then there is no possible path to success. If you agree, put DB-author inside double curly brackets {{ }} at the top of the draft. This will be a request for an Administrator to delete the draft. David notMD (talk) 03:22, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

article got rejected-any help?

hi there! My article got rejected and I thought I've done all the necessary things; sources, citation etc. Any leads? Draft:Maura Biava. Ariaserg (talk) 14:27, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Ariaserg: "done all the necessary things" No you didn't; there are entire paragraphs with no citation. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:27, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

hi, thanks for your message. Would you mind telling me which paragraph you're referring to? It's my first attempt to write a wikipedia article and still figuring things out. Ariaserg (talk) 16:26, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Ariaserg. Which of your citations are to a source which is reliably published, wholly indepednet of Biava and her associates, and contain significant coverage of her individually? It looks to me as if the answer is "none" - certainly, most of them are from galleries which have exhibited her, and so are not independent.

Unless you can find several sources which meet those triple criteria, no article is possible. If you can, then you need to write a summary of what those sources say - nothing else. Once such an article is accepted, you may be able to add a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information from non-independent sources. What Biava wants to say, or what her associates say, is almost irrelevant. ColinFine (talk) 15:37, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

hi, thank for your reply! As it is my first attempt on wikipedia writing, things are still a bit confusing to me. I chose to write about this artist that I like and discovered during my art studies in the Netherlands, and looking through the wikpedia articles of other artists I saw a lot of referencing galleries and art institutes that they have exhibited. Those institutions or, for example the Stedelijk Museum or the Freeze magazine, are not considered reliable? What could be an independent source for an artist if you don't mind giving me an example? Thanks a lot! Ariaserg (talk) 16:32, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

A place where a journalist or writer has chosen to write a substantial article, or a portion of a book, about that artist; and though they may have interviewed the artist in their research, the piece is not based on the artist's (or their associates') words. Find a good article about an artist, and look at the sources.

My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Wikipedia works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft. ColinFine (talk) 16:44, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Refueling (US spelling)

Surely this question has cropped up before, probably many times over; why are we populating numerous articles with the American spelling of fueling instead of the proper English fuelling?

As a prime example; Aerial Refueling - even the page title is 'wrong' according to the spell-checker here at the Teahouse. A quick search of the article reveals 136 examples of the US spelling, together with 24 examples of the British English variety. It hurts my eyes!

BTW - I have looked through the Help pages, and I note that we have articles titled 'color', 'harbor' and 'tire', and many more, but so far I haven't found an essay explaining or justifying en.Wikipedia's position. Where is the guidance?

WendlingCrusader (talk) 15:45, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

All the guidance is on MOS:ENGVAR. In particular we should be consistent within articles so feel free to change the british spellings to american ones in that example (not inclusive of the proper nouns which should not be altered) -- D'n'B-t -- 15:52, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

WendlingCrusader, Wikipedia is a collaborative worldwide encyclopedia project in the English language and all varieties of English spelling are accepted here. UK spelling should be used in an article about the UK, and American spelling in an article about the United States, and so on with articles about Australian and Canadian and Irish topics. For articles about topics with no direct connection with a specific English speaking country, the English variation should be established and consistent within the article, and should not be changed to another variation just because of the personal preferences of an individual editor. That is considered disruptive editing. Cullen328 (talk) 16:57, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@WendlingCrusader: Wikipedia has no spellchecker. It is your browser that does the spellchecking in edit boxes, so it works to the settings configured on your browser/OS/device. This will be helpful when they match an article's spelling standard, but unhelpful when they don't. See Wikipedia:Spellchecking. -- Verbarson  ^talk_edits 22:39, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for MOS:ENGVAR - that did the trick. You will also be pleased to know that I have just corrected nine examples of the incorrect British-English spelling variety, and as you correctly flagged up, the remainder are either buried in citations (e.g. web addresses) or are proper nouns (mostly 'Flight Refuelling Ltd').

And many thanks to the other respondents too.

WendlingCrusader (talk) 23:09, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Vittorio Storaro

Vittorio Storaro#Awards and nominations the page List of awards and nominations received by Vittorio Storaro is named Vittorio Storaro filmography 98.248.161.240 (talk) 16:17, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I'd like to help but I'm not sure what you're asking. Can you rephrase your comment as a question? –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:21, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Edit: A editor removed the filmography part of it and replaced it with the awards and nominations. The awards and noms should be in its own article though. Cowboygilbert - (talk) ♥ 04:23, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Novem Linguae, @98.248.161.240. Fixed the pages. Should all be correct now. Cowboygilbert - (talk) ♥ 04:41, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Draft:Urban Community School

I wrote my first article and posted it as an article for creation. The article was reviewed by the editor Robert McClenon who posted "This submission does not appear to be written in the formal tone expected of an encyclopedia article. Entries should be written from a neutral point of view, and should refer to a range of independent, reliable, published sources." Robert also suggested I post the article here and ask for help, which I'm doing. The article is Draft:Urban Community School.

He also asked if I had any sort of financial or other interest in the subject. I have neither. I did go to a different school in the neighborhood where UCS is located and do admire what they do for kids who live there - but that's it. Nothing financial, no conflict of interest that I'm aware of.

I could use some specifics to help me rewrite the article the way Robert wants. The information he posted his very general. So if some other editors could provide some specifics, it would be a great help. I intend to ask Robert the same question.

Urban Community School is well recognized both locally and nationally for the role it plays in helping children in a neighborhood many of whose residents are below the poverty level. I think it's notable and worthy of a Wikipedia article, that's why I wrote one.

Any help you can give me is most appreciated. Benetsee (talk) 17:42, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Benetsee. The ideal tone for our encyclopedia articles is factual, not excited or persuasive. This article isn't the worst example of promotional tone problems I've seen, but it is still leaking through in a couple spots. For example the words "unique" and "boasts".

I agree with Robert that it seems like whoever wrote this has a conflict of interest. There are insider explanations for lots of things that even include the reasoning behind the decision, rather than just stating factually what happened from an independent third party point of view. For example, Ursuline Sisters of Cleveland founded Urban Community School which they wanted to be diverse, fit and mirror the neighborhood, be affordable for all, and provide students individual learning opportunity. Removing these insider explanations of why things were done would help make the article sound less promotional.

There's also some WP:EDITORIALIZING. That is, in some spots instead of stating facts, the author is inserting their opinion. For example, demonstrates that, with support, children from poverty-stricken homes can thrive, with 90 percent going on to graduate from high school.

Hopefully this is enough to get you started. Hope this helps. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:20, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Reliable sources

 Courtesy link: Draft:SABABA 5

I'm writing an article about a band. They have several known songs that are played often on known European radios, and there a few dozens of articles and reviews about their releases. My first draft was declined and I would like to know how to choose better the relevant articles to cite from. I doubt that this band doesn't have enough reliable coverage for an article on Wikipedia.

Can anyone help? Drabeit (talk) 17:55, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Drabeit, if you doubt that Sababa 5 doesn't have enough reliable coverage, I suppose that you think it does have enough usable coverage. Usable means all of (i) reliable, (ii) disinterested (independent of Sababa 5), and (iii) substantive. Choose the best three examples. (NB Each must be reliable and disinterested and substantive.) Here (in this thread), provide a link to each of these three. -- Hoary (talk) 21:40, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

It sounds like you're claiming the band meets WP:BAND criterion #11. If they do, you would need sources to prove that, such as published playlists from radio stations. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:14, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Userpage issues...

Hello. Could I please get someone to help me figure out why my username won't render properly on my userpage? It is supposed to display in the top left reading from left to right horizontally, and when I first load the page it actually does this right for several seconds, but then for some reason it changes to reading from top to bottom in a vertical format. I did recently re-install User:Writ Keeper/Scripts/previewAndDiff.js and also installed User:BrownHairedGirl/BareURLinline.js which is a new script that I haven't used before, but I've tried uninstalling both of those and the issue persists. Bypassed cache, purge page and everything. I'm stumped. Help! Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 18:07, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Huggums537 Sounds somewhat similar to this (quite recent) Phabricator: T373617 bug. Does it seem to match your experience? When I tested your user page forcing old vector and narrowed my browser some (so seems connected to username length, number of top icons, and width of browser) I was able to see it switch from basically working to re-render your username in a narrower box so ended up vertical. Skynxnex (talk) 18:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Right. I had no issues loading it incognito mode so it kinda seems to match my experience, but the thing is that I haven't added any extra top icons that I didn't already have before or reduced any of my browser width so I don't understand why I should only just now be matching that experience when I wasn't having that experience before. If I can figure that part out, then I might solve my problem. Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 18:32, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Skynxnex, maybe I'll try a different skin and see if that works. If I do that will my common.js and vector.js scripts continue to work with the new skin? I mean are there any good skins compatible with these scripts? Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 18:45, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

It looks fine to me using my default of Timeless (and vector-2022 as well). My point above is that it appears it's a recent regression that was maybe deployed today (I haven't looked up when the Thursday deploy normally happens during the day) and so likely would be fixed for vetor-2010 at some point soon. Skynxnex (talk) 18:59, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Skynxnex, thanks. I tried vector-2022 and it did fix the problem, but a bunch of other stuff rendered in funny ways so that opened up a whole new can of worms for me. Plus, at least one of my vector.js scripts did not run so there is more work to do. I'll be happy the old vector will work correctly soon, but people using the default have prolly been thinking my page looks pretty silly for a long time now, and that after all the time I spent getting it to render just right on the skin I was using. Oh, well. That's what I get for not remembering that everything doesn't work right everywhere all the time like it should in the ideal world... Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 19:26, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hey, @Skynxnex I removed a bunch of extraneous top icons and whatnots from my sandbox because the issue started happening on all my userpages including talk not just my main userpage and what I discovered is that even with nothing there my username is very bunched up or crowded just running a couple scripts I use though it does render horizontal, not vertical so there you go. Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 01:30, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Huggums537: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Huggums537?safemode=1 omits all user scripts and looks OK to me at my normal window size but it wraps the page name in a narrow window. You can try {{DISPLAYTITLE:<span class="nowrap">{{FULLPAGENAME}}</span>}}. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:51, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter, that actually helped out some. I tested it in my sandbox and it made the username render ok, but one of the scripts is still acting funny so I'm going to see if I can track it down to find out if there were any recent changes made to it that might be related to the problem somehow. Thanks very much. Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 11:08, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Ok, so I removed that one script: User:Bradv/Scripts/Superlinks.js and the problem went away on all userpages, but there hasn't been any changes to the script since 2020. The only change I have noticed is that in the uppermost section of my userpages now contains an [edit] section where I don't recall one being there before when I was editing my pages so perhaps some new media software changes are clashing with that script? Huggums^{537_voted! (sign🖋️|📞talk)} 11:41, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Living Persons Biography

 Courtesy link: Steve Englebright

How does one add details of marriage, children, etc.. to a living persons biography? GeologyRocks1 (talk) 18:38, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

GeologyRocks, that requires a reference to a reliable, published source that verifies the content that you want to add. We do not normally give the names of non-notable minor children unless they have been widely publicized with the consent of the parents. Otherwise, the accepted practice is to simply state the number of the children. Cullen328 (talk) 19:58, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for replying. In my original, and then follow up question, I did source 2 sites - one article and one official website- that verify Steve's marital status and that he has 2 grown children, in addition to the fact that he is now a sitting County Legislator. I was just wondering how to update?. Names of the 'children' are not necessary but the sources are reliable. GeologyRocks1 (talk) 20:18, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

GeologyRocks, the article is not protected. You can go ahead and edit the article, citing your source. Referencing for beginners explains how. Cullen328 (talk) 22:46, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Are the references correct

Hi! I was wondering if someone could take a quick look over Draft:Actinote zikani and see if I got the references correct, I'm not sure if they're formatted properly. Thanks! :) Sir MemeGod :D (talk - contribs - created articles) 20:13, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

At first glance, the references look correct. There's also an "External links" which looks correct, but should follow the "References" section, not precede it. Then there's a "Bibliography references" section, which seems to be more references, but put in a separate section, and having page numbers but no other bibliographical details or links. Maproom (talk) 21:20, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Sir MemeGod Journal of Entomology and Zoology Studies is a predatory journal which is deprecated as a source. You have plenty of other sources, so I would remove those citations. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:52, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Creating an Article based off Freightliner Custom Chassis

I tried to create a page based off Freightliner Custom Chassis division of Freightliner, based in South Carolina, United States.https://www.freightlinerchassis.com/about/ Winnebaggo (talk) 20:43, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Do you have a question, Winnebaggo? -- Hoary (talk) 21:28, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Winnebaggo. In order to create an article about any subject, you must first show that the subject meets Wikipedia's criteria for notability - roughly, that several people wholly unconnected with the subject have thought it worth spending the time to research and write about the subject, and been published in reliable places.

You have only two sources in Draft:Freightliner Custom Chassis (which is not usually enough to establish notability) and neither of them is independent of FCC. Wikipedia has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources.

Your draft has been declined, rather than rejected, which means that the reviewer is giving you a chance to find more suitable sources. But all that you added after the first decline was a link to a source which is not only not independent, but does not mention FCC at all. The point of a citation is to verify a claim in the article about the subject of the article: there is almost never any point in citing a source which doesn't mention the subject.

I'm afraid that you have written the draft BACKWARDS, as many new editor do when they try to create an article. ColinFine (talk) 21:29, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

want to search revisions

hi i wanna search all the revisions for an article for some work is there any way to do this? :) 2600:1700:8410:1560:C9FD:BC4D:1F54:67ED (talk) 21:04, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

WP:WikiBlame? Solomon Ucko (talk) 21:26, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Emotional Freedom Techniques article

Hello Wikipedia/Wikimedia: I am disturbed whenever Wikipedia asks me for money, AND at the same time continues its biased and skeptical stance on Emotional Freedom Techniques, or EFT. Even on a quick search of PubMed, there are randomized controlled clinical trials published on the efficacy of EFT on combat-related PTSD, which Wikipedia's article repeatedly ignores. Here is a citation for one such RCT:

• Randomized Controlled Trial. J Nerv Ment Dis. 2013 Feb;201(2):153-60. doi:10.1097/NMD.0b013e31827f6351. Dawson Church 1, Crystal Hawk, Audrey J Brooks, Olli Toukolehto, Maria Wren, Ingrid Dinter, Phyllis Stein Psychological trauma symptom improvement in veterans using emotional freedom techniques: a randomized controlled trial.

The trial concluded the following: "The EFT subjects had significantly reduced psychological distress (p < 0.0012) and PTSD symptom levels (p < 0.0001) after the test. In addition, 90% of the EFT group no longer met PTSD clinical criteria, compared with 4% in the SOC/WL group. After the wait period, the SOC/WL subjects received EFT. In a within-subjects longitudinal analysis, 60% no longer met the PTSD clinical criteria after three sessions. This increased to 86% after six sessions for the 49 subjects who ultimately received EFT and remained at 86% at 3 months and at 80% at 6 months. The results are consistent with that of other published reports showing EFT's efficacy in treating PTSD and comorbid symptoms and its long-term effects."

What is the source of this continued bias? Do you not realize there are readers who know this field, use EFT for their own benefit (for over 15 years in my case) and KNOW BETTER...and are annoyed at an apparent conflict of interest that may include not only extreme bias, but also a potential financial incentive from those who wish to discredit EFT by keeping legitimate research on this topic from being cited in a Wikipedia article? I seriously doubt that this is due to incompetence on Wikipedia's part. If not, then why this continued, obviously biased, stance?

Yet you're asking for a contribution from individuals who know just how enduringly flawed your EFT article is. This is truly disturbing; what explanation can you offer? I appreciate your attention and await your reply - thank you! 47.196.118.82 (talk) 21:54, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Are you implying that there's a connection between what Wikipedia says about Emotional Freedom Techniques and the money you might donate? Fortunately, Wikipedia is well enough funded that it will not be influenced by such inducements. Maproom (talk) 22:06, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

If "individuals who know just how enduringly flawed [the] EFT article is" have suggestions for it that are soundly based on reliable, disinterested sources, then they are free to make these suggestions at Talk:Emotional Freedom Techniques. If anyone doesn't want to be asked for money, they can create a user ID, log in under that user ID, stay logged in for up to one year, and not see requests for money. -- Hoary (talk) 22:12, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Plus, any money that you donate goes to the already exceedingly well funded Wikimedia Foundation. It does not go to volunteers here on the English Wikipedia. Cullen328 (talk) 00:06, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

A journal article about a randomized controlled trial is considered a WP:MEDRS primary source and is therefore of limited usefulness, if at all. We need secondary sources (surveys of many different trials conducted by different researchers). ~Anachronist (talk) 00:10, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

To recap the above: The Foundation's requests for donations and what the volunteers do at Wikipedia have no connection. None. As for the article about Emotional Freedom Techniques, as pointed out by Anachronist, for health/medicine articles, Wikipedia does not accept individual clinical trials as evidence/references. The article's existing references are published reviews, and support the conclusion that EFT is not proven effective. The Talk page of the article additionally points out that 'predatory journals', meaning that in this context those will published submitted trial reports for payment without providing editorial expert review of the quality of those submissions. David notMD (talk) 03:42, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

The essay Wikipedia:Lunatic charlatans describes a somewhat similar controversy back in 2013, and includes a statement by Jimmy Wales. Cullen328 (talk) 04:26, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

WMF ignoring or just not responding to my emails?????

Is there a reason behind this?????? I've been emailing them every day for the past week and they haven't been responding and they're not being any help at all! I don't know how else to get in contact with them if they're not responding to the emails I send them on a day to day basis! 149.86.34.94 (talk) 23:46, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

What are you trying to do? Maybe a daily email to some rando at WMF is not the correct approach? -- zzuuzz ^(talk) 23:50, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Exclamation marks! Multiple question marks???? Messages every day: If it were me who viewed these messages (or anyway the first of them), I'd assign them a very low priority. -- Hoary (talk) 00:02, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

So, you're spamming them. Non-response is exactly what you should expect. If you're sending emails to any of the VRTS addresses, well, many people assume those addresses are handled by WMF but they are handled by volunteer editors like me. What problem are you having that cannot be handled on this page or the help desk page? ~Anachronist (talk) 00:06, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

i think your problem is they way your approaching them. Please keep all emails calm and collected state your URGENT problem and wait for a response. it's not that hard, but if you are spamming them they won't answer you or they will just totally ignore you completely so PLEASE follow sentience two. Stuuf7 (talk) 01:03, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Citing for nitroglycerin

Hello! I wanted to know if The Anarchist Cookbook is a reliable source to cite for this article. It contains some info about this chemical, but I question its reliability. There is a copy of it on the Internet Archive, I believe. Kurnahusa (talk) 02:01, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Kurnahusa, clearly the Cookbook neither is an academic work nor was written by somebody with an advanced degree in chemistry. So if you want a simple answer, then it's no. But what do you want to cite it for? -- Hoary (talk) 02:15, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Hoary The Nitroglycerin#Manufacturing part, which needs more citations. Kurnahusa (talk) 02:21, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Kurnahusa, try a chemistry text. -- Hoary (talk) 02:29, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I've found some sources [9] [10]. Some websites aren't open access unless log in through an institution which sucks. I'm a little too tired to edit at this point and my competence is at the bare minimum so I'll give editing a rest for now. Kurnahusa (talk) 03:02, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

A bombmaking and illegal drug manufacturing manual written by a teenager is not a reliable source. Cullen328 (talk) 04:34, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Kurnahusa, thank you for confessing that your "competence is at the bare minimum". As it's been decades since I last opened a chemistry textbook (either a very elementary one or one from the 1930s (!) that even then I only partially and hazily understood), my own competence would be seriously inadequate. Perhaps ask for help at WT:WikiProject Chemicals? -- Hoary (talk) 06:10, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Kurnahusa In this case, it is easy to find reliable manufacturing references from the compound's PubChem entry. If you could add the two cited sources to the article, that would be great. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:35, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

A Suggestion

Hi, I observed that there are many concerns we need to address, or else they will become extreme in the future.

Major concerns like Global Warming, Climate Change, and Water pollution are growing rapidly, but many people are unaware of these. Only well-educated people can understand these issues and take significant steps. Given that people who spend their time at Wikipedia are well-educated, I suggest that if there is a way to show these concerns as a pop-up message or on the homepage whenever someone visits the site. it will be helpful. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 09:13, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi Perfectodefecto. While I personally agree with you that such things are serious concerns, I don't think your suggestion falls within Wikipedia's scope per WP:NOT. Wikipedia articles can include neutrally worded content about how such things are serious concerns and how efforts are being made by some to increase awareness of them, but such content can only reflect what's written in WP:SECONDARY reliable sources; Wikipedia itself isn't set up to be used to directly increase awareness of such things in the way you suggest per WP:ADVOCACY. -- Marchjuly (talk) 09:26, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

alright. Thanks. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 09:36, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Perfectodefecto I suggest that you read WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS. Cullen328 (talk) 17:48, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Got it. Thanks. —𝐏𝐞𝐫𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐟𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐨(𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔) 18:34, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Dead link of book sources

I found a dead link that isn't archived and the page of the author that's on the website is devoid of his books, so I thought I can find another website hosting information about the book. I used the ISBN to find an Amazon and Walmart page of the book but I'm not confident about some of the factors pertaining to the replacing the dead link with alternate sources. (I'm not sure what's the dead link suppose to show because there isn't a snapshot on wayback machine, archive.today and google cite).

The reason I'm considering to change the dead link with other sources is because the first paragraph of this section said to "consider finding an alternative source" with fulfilled condition of "all attempts to repair the link will be unsuccessful" (Which I think it is because the author page doesn't have his books and there's no found snapshots on some of the most popular archive services.). With my interpretation, the second sentence "Alternative sources about broad topics are usually easily located" implies there can be a broad selection with the only following stated conditions to be "but be extremely careful to avoid citing mirrors and forks of Wikipedia itself, which would violate Wikipedia:Verifiability.".

Some of the information I'm trying to find to help what to do are: What are the conditions to choosing and listing an alternate source for a dead link, specifically when entailing a book. If the condition of "all attempts to repair the link will be unsuccessful" is fulfilled, should there be attempts to replace the dead link with alternate sources, not at all or some other actions? I haven't found information on how to properly link to a book source so, what's expected to be of the reliability, legality and other factors when linking to a book source (copyrighted, not public domain) on both of the circumstances of book metadata and book content. DedoraTuolloin (talk) 09:23, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@DedoraTuolloin I'll try to answer the specific question rather than the general. The dead link in the article just confirms he wrote and published a book. There's no problem in finding a link to the book: for example this one at google books The article already has as its next citation a secondary CBS source. In this case, therefore, I'd be inclined to create a {{cite book}} reference to replace what's currently there, with the Google books link as the |URL= parameter. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:22, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Since you can only answered 1 of the questions. Can you list or link any articles or information that might help me in answering the rest of the questions? DedoraTuolloin (talk) 13:32, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

If the book is already the best and most reliable source, then showing people what they can do to get the book (giving them a link to where they can buy it, and links to where they can borrow it or view it if that's possible) is good enough. "If you bring me that book I can prove to you that the information is in there" IS a good enough reference, as long as it's said truthfully and the book really is a reliable source.

It's always good to also have other reliable sources, but don't take away the book info. "You'll have to buy the book to know for sure" is a pain, and of course nobody really likes it, but it's still legitimate. TooManyFingers (talk) 16:40, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

TooManyFingers, no, I am sorry, but we do not routinely link to bookselling sites, whether it is the publisher or a company like Amazon. That's promotional editing and not permitted on Wikipedia. Cullen328 (talk) 17:53, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

There does not have to be a link. It's sufficient to give the full bibliographical details of the book: these would enable anyone to obtain the book from its publisher (directly or via vendors) if it's in print, or from second-hand vendors if it isn't. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.1.209.45 (talk) 19:02, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@DedoraTuolloin You should find WP:Link rot useful for the more general issue. Mike Turnbull (talk) 19:59, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Talk pages

How do I remove my own topic from a talk page? I accidentally added one without being logged in and I'm not comfortable with my IP address being displayed. Degenlate624 (talk) 10:31, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Degenlate624 Since you want your IP removed (that's reasonable), I think WP:SUPPRESS is the way to go. Check it and follow the "email the oversight team" link. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:59, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Removing Precise Coordinates from Article about Private Property/Sensitive Ecological Site

I'm a representative of the organization that owns the property mentioned in this article Singer Lake Bog. We don't mind that an article has been written about one of our properties but we would prefer that the exact coordinates not be listed in the article. Because we manage a sensitive ecological sites that are not open to the public, such as this one, we try to keep exact locations low profile to not attract unwanted attention to them. What is the correct process for me to request the exact coordinates be removed from the article? I made an edit myself which was reversed as "vandalism" and the person who reversed it kindly directed me here. Thank you in advance! 2603:6010:DA01:E6:DD2E:C291:2C66:F3E (talk) 10:38, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Your edit [11] was obviously not WP:VANDALISM and @Panian513 shouldn't have called it that. I'm not at all sure what the WP-right thing to do is here, though you seem reasonable to me. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:12, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

You will also need to follow up Google Maps (which identifies 'Singer Lake, Ohio') and OpenStreetMap (which specifically marks 'Singer Lake Bog'). A web search brings up numerous other sites that either describe or plot the location. I appreciate the need to keep the location of sensitive ecosystems and rare species secret from those foolish enough to damage them, but it looks as if this particular cat is well out of the bag. -- Verbarson  ^talk_edits 11:41, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

IP editor. As Verbarson says, the removal of the coordinates may not help much but what would, surely, help would be if you could substantially expand that article with more coverage from reliable sources, including the fact that it isn't open to the public, which currently is not mentioned. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:50, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I think the "Singer Lake" label on Google Maps is a relatively new addition since I had them delist it as a park last year. I've been on somewhat of a crusade to obfuscate our preserves since I started, though I hadn't considered OpenStreetMap that's very helpful. And you are probably correct that the cat is out of the bag on this one, it is one of our higher profile sites but I guess I just look at it as trying to tie up loose ends where I can. Plus I got to learn from you wonderful people about interacting with Wikipedia! 2603:6010:DA01:E6:DD2E:C291:2C66:F3E (talk) 18:48, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I agree with Mike Turnbull's suggestion, but I must point out that if you were to get involved with editing that article you would be within Wikipedia's definition of editing with a conflict of interest, and probably a paid editor.

That doesn't mean that you can't contribute to it, but you should make a public declaration of your status, and should submit edit requests rather than editing the article directly. (Please read the pages I've linked if you want to understand more about these).

Alternatively, if you have a published source| that says that Singer Lake Bog is not open to the public, I would be happy to add that to the article, citing the source. Unfortunately, while https://www.cmnh.org/discover/nature/natural-areas-program/museum-natural-areas certainly implies that, it does not say so explicitly. (The paragraph about sites which are open to the public does not make it clear whether those it lists are the only sites which are open or a selection from them). ColinFine (talk) 12:07, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

In addition to the suggestions made above, Wikipedia needs one or more photos of the reserve. Please follow the guidance at WP:A picture of you (which is about people, but the principles are the same). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 15:24, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Then again, that might just drive more people to seek to visit the place :P Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 15:55, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I did wonder if this discussion would evoke the Streisand effect. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 17:37, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Not that many people are looking at it, we're probably fine. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:40, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Very helpful thank you so much! I'll discuss with my colleagues about how we want to approach this, since I do think the article existing is worthwhile since it is a particularly noteworthy site, and some of what is there right now definitely made us scratch our heads. We'd also like to get an article together at some point for Mentor Marsh, since that is open to the public and another significant and noteworthy project of ours. 2603:6010:DA01:E6:DD2E:C291:2C66:F3E (talk) 18:51, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

While you are discussing this with colleagues, please bear in mind that Wikipedia does not allow role accounts (for example SingerLakePR): each person intending to contribute should create their own account after reading WP:PAID and WP:COI. We want to encourage your contributions but ask that you are aware of Wikipedia's norms. WP:ASFAQ has more information. Mike Turnbull (talk) 19:55, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

A question about why people keep saying ill get blocked

Hello, i have a question about editing. If i edit a article, and change a line in a sentence to make the tone more energetic and detailed , is it not allowed? and also, why? Isnt all articles, just a bunch of peoples opinion becuase if somoen disagrees with a part of the article they can fix it? FroZt Writer (talk) 10:56, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@FroZt Writer Your Talk Page has considerable detail about the specific problem, which is that you are adding your own interpretations to make the tone more energetic and detailed. On Wikipedia, that's called original research and is forbidden. If an external published and reliable source says something is "mysterious" then a Wikipedia article on that topic can say it is, citing that source. Without the source, by policy we stick to a neutral point of view. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:04, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@FroZt Writer See WP:TONE for some guidance. The aim for any WP-article is for it to be a summary of WP:RS on the subject. Reasonable people can disagree on how this should be done in specific situations, and if that happens, they can WP:COMMUNICATE. Hope this helps some. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:04, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! FroZt Writer (talk) 11:06, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

You started editing today, and so far, every one of your edits has been reverted, and on your Talk page you have repeatedly been warned. For this reason, your activity is seen as not here to improve the encyclopedia. and you are at risk for being indefinitely blocked. What you have been adding is your opinions on the topics. For example, at the beginning of a Lead you added "Known all around the world for its bouncing rhythm catchy tune and mysterious tone." David notMD (talk) 12:59, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello,

Wikipedia is not just some opinion or blog you write whatever you like. Also excessive words and weavil words are not allowed. You are expected to stay neutral. You can check out the editing guide for way forward Tesleemah (talk) 13:22, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Sorry not to assume good faith, but please look at the edit history, and you'll see clearly DO NOT FEED THE TROLL! 10mmsocket (talk) 13:14, 30 August 2024 (UTC) Read WP:NOTHERE alongside the edit history. 10mmsocket (talk) 13:16, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Blocked for disruptive editing. 10mmsocket (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@FroZt Writer From first edit to being indefinitely blocked in under three hours is fast, but not a record. You can appeal to request being unblocked, but this will require admission that everything you did - adding descriptions that were your own opinions - was wrong, and you will not do it again. Please do not bother unless you think you can change to adding referenced facts to articles rather than opinions. David notMD (talk) 16:51, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I don't know if it's a record, but I recall many years ago I blocked a legal-threat-making attorney representing Ziauddin Butt within minutes of creating a new account to evade the prior block. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:48, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

After checking, my recollection wasn't quite correct. It was 64 minutes. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:52, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Any uninvolved editor may close most discussions,

As Any uninvolved editor can close the discussion, I have been waiting for several days to close the RfC for the link below. It seems that the administrator is busy, so if you are not involved in the RfC, please close it.

Talk:2024 United States presidential election#RfC: Trump infobox photo. Goodtiming8871 (talk) 11:11, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

I see it's on rfcl. Waiting sucks, but it'll happen at some point. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:22, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Goodtiming8871, this isn't really the place, you can request a closure at Wikipedia:Requests for closure. Zippybonzo | talk | contribs (they/them) 11:49, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

They did that. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:55, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia article cites opinion piece from untrusted news source

In the critical reception section on the fourth paragraph of the Wikipedia page for the 2024 Twisters movie, the article cites FOX News which according to the reliable sources page should never be sourced for political news and also has some consensus as of 2023 to not be cited as a source at all on this website. I read the FOX article in question and it starts off as a simple movie review but it keeps going on about climate change and the left. My point is, it's classified as an opinion piece on the FOX website and it appears to use buzzwords and also injects politics into a review about an action movie. I also want to add that I am not one who often reads movie reviews, so I am unsure if mentioning politics is unusual for a review. The Wikipedia article wouldn't lose or gain anything by deleting the citation, changing the citation, or deleting the paragraph entirely in my opinion, since the paragraph is mostly a comment about the racial diversity of the cast and a survey of moviegoers on how they heard of the movie. No one else seems to notice the citation, and if they have, they don't seem to care, so I may just be creating a problem from nothing or letting my personal left-leaning bias influence my choices, so I would like someone else's take on this before I change anything about this paragraph.

If you want to read the FOX article to judge if it's a good source, here's the link

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/twisters-whips-up-lessons-disney-far-left-hollywood ApteryxRainWing (talk) 12:11, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. You're more likely to get constructive discussion on this topic on the article's talk page, where I see you've opened up a new thread already. Reconrabbit 13:37, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Personal information

How can I write my biography as an historical information for my dearest friend and family. 39.47.26.174 (talk) 14:29, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

IP user, please see our guidance on autobiographies. It's generally heavily discouraged as it can be quite difficult to write neutrally when writing about ourselves. It's also quite difficult to avoid working backwards, as we already know everyhting about ourselves.

Generally speaking, if you're notable enough to warrant an article, someone will make one in good time. You can also request that an article be created here.

If you still want to go ahead with this, please see WP:YFA, WP:42 and specifically the autobiography guideline section here. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 14:36, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello, IP user, and welcome to the Teahouse. Writing an autobiography for your friends and family is a fine and laudable aim - but Wikipedia is almost certainly not the place for it. What you probably want to write is about your experiences, your feelings, your thoughts: almost none of that belongs in Wikipedia.

If there is ever a Wikipedia article about you, it will not be based on your reminiscences, but almost 100% on what people who don't know you have published about you - even if you disagree with some of what they say. If there is not much independent material about you, then that means that, like most of us, you do not meet Wikipedia's criterai of notability, and there cannot be an article about you. ColinFine (talk) 15:11, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

The best way to do that project is probably to use paper, and to make a full history of the whole family, not just you. Then make a pretty large number of copies that you can give to anyone who wants it. People who want the family history are going to want to look at it again in 30 years; digital storage always fails, and viewing software often quits working. Paper doesn't fail except by obvious damage, and if you spread many paper copies around to different places, then even if two copies are ruined in a fire or a flood, the others are still OK and can be copied again. TooManyFingers (talk) 16:27, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

The policy WP:NOTMEMORIAL applies here. Short answer, no, you shouldn't attempt to write an article. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:24, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Per TMF and other editors' comments, what you have in mind is a memoir rather than an encyclopedia article. A plus for a memoir is that you do not need to include independent references to confirm facts (a Wikipedia requirement).

AFD Question

how do i add a AFD such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Halla_Airlines_Embraer_Brasilia_crash into the category https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:AfD_debates_(Places_and_transportation) after using twinkle to automate the AFD for me? Lolzer3000 (talk) 18:50, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

You tagged 2023 Halla Airlines Embraer Brasilia crash for proposed deletion or PROD, a totally different deletion process. At this point, my suggestion is to follow the instructions on the PROD banner on the article: If this template is removed, do not replace it. The article may be deleted if this message remains in place for seven days, i.e., after 18:46, 6 September 2024 (UTC) (formatting original). If someone else removes the template, then go to AfD. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 19:33, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

hello

I just wanted to say hello OkIunderstandthat (talk) 19:07, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello. This page is for asking questions about editing Wikipedia. Do you have one? ~Anachronist (talk) 20:22, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

IP exempt explaination

Hi Wikipedians, I hope you are all doing good. I just wanted to ask that it shows I have an IP exempt till November 29th, so does that mean I won't be able to continue after that. Thanks for your time. Prober90 (talk) 20:49, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Certainly you can continue if you are editing from a non-blocked IP address. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:57, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

The problem is my IP is a shared one and is blocked. I had to request my account. Prober90 (talk) 21:00, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

@Prober90 You are currently IP block exempt and WP:EXEMPT suggests you can ask for an extension and describes how to do so. Mike Turnbull (talk) 21:33, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

ok thanks. Prober90 (talk) 21:35, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

ClueBot III question

How long will it take for {{User:ClueBot III/ArchiveNow}} to make User:ClueBot III perform a bot edit to User talk:Ss0jse? Ss0jse (talk) 20:52, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

My understanding is that archiving activities run once per night. I know that's true for MiszaBot and it's replacement but I am not sure about ClueBot. ~Anachronist (talk) 20:59, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Granted, I have been changing the settings multiple times in the past hour: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Ss0jse&action=history Ss0jse (talk) 21:01, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Resolved

 – Please archive this section, either manually or automatically

. Ss0jse (talk) 22:35, 30 August 2024 (UTC)