Template talk:Secularism in France

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Obscure and misleading title

The term Laïcité is a French and not an English word, and template names normally should be in English. There is an English cognate, namely laicity (control by the laity) but this is a rather obscure word and the term secular[ism] is used far more often for essentially the same concept, both in English generally, as well as in template or category names about this topic for other countries (Belgium, UK, etc.).

It's true that there is an article Laïcité on English WP which began as an article about the French laws pertaining to religion, and if limited to that topic would perhaps be the correct title (with italics maintained as they are now to indicate the foreign loanword status in English). However, that article was expanded to include Turkey, Mexico and other countries, for which the use of the French term makes no sense at all; there is no such concept for example as Laïcité in the United States. Indeed, the {{Main}} links in the subsections are to main articles which use the word secularism in the title (in two cases) and separation of church and state in another.

As in the case of that article, the template should either be renamed, or the content links restricted to topics concerning French laws concerning secularism and the separation of church and state.

If opened to countries outside France, then a template title such as State law on religion, Secularism, or Separation of church and state would be better.

Even if restricted to French laws, I don't see any way to enforce that with the simple title Laïcité, so even in that case, a rename to French laws on religion, Secularism in France, or Separation of church and state in France would probably be needed to maintain some focus in the template content. If editors felt strongly about using the term Laïcité in the title, I suppose it could be called "Laïcité in France" or "French laïcité" but this seems both redundant and awkward, and I'd prefer "Secularism in France".

I suppose I should add that I'm by no means biased concerning French terms in English where they improve the article; indeed, I've contributed to French WP and am well aware of what Laïcité means both as a word as well as a hot button issue in France. I just think that here on English WP the French term is neither known nor helpful. Mathglot (talk) 22:43, 14 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]