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If you see an unfamiliar username start commenting on future discussions. I am in the process of changing my username from WestVirginiaWX to Hurricane Clyde. West Virginia WXeditor (talk) 04:26, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Help requested

It appears that almost every violent tornado is getting an article nowadays, including ones that don't need them. I've now found several articles that were written up over the Summer and am no longer willing to fight them. However, the really need to be rewritten, so that they meet are current written guidelines and readers can understand them. Can I get your help please? ChessEric 17:45, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Yeah of course ChessEric! Shoot me a link to ones that need rewriting. A while ago, I made a list of stand-alone tornado articles (User:WeatherWriter#Naders). If you see I am missing one, feel free to add it. But yeah, shoot me a link to those that need rewriting. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 18:25, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

There are going to be a number of them because I deem all the ones that weren't written by me or you to need to be rewritten. I'm sorry if I seem like I'm trying to be high and mighty, but I always tried to mirror TI12 when writing sections and feel like I'm the closest to him when writing them. This is why I always go back and rewrite things. I deem you to be the closest to me in that regard, which is why I'm asking for your help. I'll link you the ones I think need fixing. ChessEric 19:05, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

You can start with this one. ChessEric 19:07, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

You can also help me to get the new editors to learn how to make refs, enter things into templates, and use long dashes in titles instead of short ones. I'm going to have an aneurysm trying to keep track of this stuff. These articles are coming out at a rapid-fire pace and not all of them are needed. For Christ sakes, I got rid of the section for 2016 EF4 Katie tornado because of how short it was, and someone made an article for it. Do you think we should start shutting down some of these articles being created? TI12 and US Man would have an absolute fit if they saw all these. ChessEric 19:17, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

"Shutting down" maybe isn't the right phrase. But, I'm glad you mentioned some of that. If they are too short, then rather than an AFD, a merge discussion should probably be started. Here is my personal take on how to do individual tornado articles (I am one of the more "lenient" WP:Weather editors):

• The article would be/is at least 4 paragraphs (good ones) in length and it isn't in an outbreak article and no "aftermath" info. EX: 2012 Center Point–Clay tornado or 1973 Central Alabama tornado. This one is an article by shear length of impacts and/or large-scale coverage.
• The article would be/is at least 4 paragraphs (good ones) in length and is it isn't in an outbreak article and has LASTING impacts/coverage via an aftermath section. EX: 2023 Pasadena–Deer Park tornado or 1764 Woldegk tornado. Article is based on LASTING impacts/coverage.
• The article would be/is at least 4 paragraphs (good ones) in length and is part of an outbreak article and has LASTING impacts/coverage via an aftermath section. EX: 2002 Van Wert–Roselms tornado (borderline) or 2023 Rolling Fork–Silver City tornado. Article is based on LASTING impacts/coverage and most likely length of details on the tornado.

I say good paragraphs, as I more or less look at the byte size rather than actual size. For example, the 2023 Rolling Fork article is 51k bytes, while the outbreak article is 109k bytes. That is a huge percentage difference. Same with the 2024 Greenfield tornado article, which is 24k bytes while the outbreak article is 88k bytes (with the list removed). Some of the articles created maybe need to be merged back into the outbreak article, but I would look at what percentage that tornado would be of the outbreak article. I do differ from, for example US Man, on that process. For me, at that page-length (20k-ish bytes), the article would be long enough to have a shot at GA status. Chances are, at that length also, it is probably 10-15% or more of the article outbreak, meaning one tornado is 10-15%+ of an article about say 50-60 tornadoes. That is how I look at it for individual tornado articles. 2022 Pembroke–Black Creek tornado is probably my best example: Tornado article size is 20k bytes with the outbreak article (which still has a section for the tornado) is at 115k bytes. That is 115k bytes for 89 tornadoes. A merge of the article back into the page would make that single tornado roughly 15-16% of the whole outbreak article.

(2016 Katie talk): Realistically, once a good check and fixes are done over say the 2016 Katie tornado (10k bytes only), it could probably easily be merged back into the outbreak article (67k bytes). Even at first glance, that "aftermath" section for the tornado isn't a real "aftermath" section, with a large chunk of that being removed more than likely. That whole section is nearly 50% of the bytes of the article. Removing that takes the article to 5-6k bytes, which is not even C-class and no chance for a GA. That is one would I would support a merge back into the outbreak article, due to lack of article size and lack of clear LASTING impacts/coverage.

Rant Over: Hopefully that whole thing explains my process and how I would handle individual tornado articles. Some probably need merging back into an outbreak article, others may just need a good rewriting...along with more research/LASTING coverage/impacts being mentioned. I wish we could hold almost like a "class" on how to write solid articles on tornadoes and tornado outbreaks. That would solve so many problems 😅. Would you like me to start on the 2016 Katie tornado or the 2011 Shoal Creek Valley-Ohatchee tornado? The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 21:27, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Oh, and here is a neat trick to check sizes ChessEric: Type {{section size}} at the top section of any article talk page. That will show you every section and how many bytes it is. The larger percentage the section is of the article's total size, the more red it will highlight it. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 21:29, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

I just mentioned Katie; I wanted you to do the Ohatchee one. However, you can do the Katie one if it's that short. Also...wow. I didn't expect a long answer. LOL! Also, your right; "Shutting down" wasn't the right phrase. I was in a rush and that was the first thing that came to mind. Thanks for the tip by the way. It will be useful to me.

As a side note, all the new articles that I have been seeing are in the 2010-present timeframe and are likely not on your list. I fixed up the 2011 Lake Martin tornado and 2015 Garland tornado articles in the midst of me working on the 2024 Elkhorn–Blair tornado articles, but it's going to take me awhile to get to the other ones, especially with my final semester of college starting tomorrow. One more thing I will note is to be cautious about talking about tornadoes weakening and strengthening when they're over open terrain (i.e. 2024 Greenfield tornado). It's nearly impossible to know if that is actually occurring when they aren't hitting anything. ChessEric 22:29, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

One more thing; please ping Cyclonebiskit with these recent issues we've been having here. His expertise in the absence of TI12 and US Man would be much appreciated, even if he isn't around much anymore. ChessEric 20:19, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Will do when needed. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 21:27, 18 August 2024 (UTC)